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KillBOX!
- Thread starter BigWorm
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I haven't heard that term used in a while...
Back to the original post:
It's not just the AF .... the airlines are leading the way, in fact.
Several years ago, the edict came down from Flight Ops that the "cockpit" would hereinafter be referred to as the "flight deck" .... after some mid level management female types with the connivance of some of our "female" pilots determined that "cockpit" was "sexist and offensive" ......
I said: "Bullshit. The "flight deck" is the roof on an aircraft carrier .... "
I continued to (and still do) call it the "cockpit" ... especially over the PA ..... with relish (no pun) to the eternal consternation of the PC crowd. I did it for the 10 years prior to my retirement. What were they gonna' do?? Cancel the Tokyo flight 'cause I was driving it???
They only can "take" the ground that we give up to them, boys ....
Xtndr50boom
Voted 8.9 average on the Hot-or-Not scale
I meant to write "maybe he should've" instead of "I would have". Edit in progress
Wow. I just joined airwarriors.com, and this is the first thread I read. Seems like a bit of USAF bashing around here. A few comments:
First, on the subject of "box/head/sts". It has NOTHING to do with political correctness, so get off that soap box. I find the whole thing childish too, but it's simply a "word game", if you will, like many traditions where you must buy rounds or pay money, should you violate the rules. It's been going on for over 20 years. I'm actually surprised that those of you that have flown fighters don't know this. Surely, you've been to Red Flag, and have had interactions with USAF pilots, right?
HH-60H: You are typing many inaccuracies about FAIPs. They do not get their first choice after their FAIP tour; they compete with the other FAIPs. FAIPs coming out of the T-38 are also lined up for bombers, not just fighters. You did not mention the T-6/T-37, and those pilots get FAIP'd too.
Getting FAIP'd is a "positive"? Not sure what you mean, but in many cases, it is not, WRT career progression in your follow-on weapon system. As for you comment that FAIPs are cocky asses: how many do you know? Of course, I do note that, while most FAIP's are asses, your buddy is cool. What a coincidence. Right.
SemperGumbi: you're bashing on pilots doing multiple radar patterns? This, coming from a pilot that spends how many months in the T-45 bounce pattern? I'm assuming you're not a sergrad, and flew something in the fleet (curious, what did you fly), but either way, if you've got wings, you should know that FAIPs do NOT call themselves "fighter pilots". The majority of FAIPs are in the T-1 and T-6. Only T-38 FAIPs (and a small number of the T-6 FAIPs) will get fighter follow ons. Based on how you told the story, you weren't even there,... you heard it second hand from a Hornet friend. Hardly solid ground to say that "FAIPs call themselves fighter pilots".
A4sForever: what airline were you working for when that "cockpit vs flight deck" edict came down? That's pretty sad.
Now if y'all get so much enjoyment out of bashing the USAF, then have at it. Seems immature to me, but what do I know: I wave at other pilots when I see them.
But, try to at least keep your bashing factual.
First, on the subject of "box/head/sts". It has NOTHING to do with political correctness, so get off that soap box. I find the whole thing childish too, but it's simply a "word game", if you will, like many traditions where you must buy rounds or pay money, should you violate the rules. It's been going on for over 20 years. I'm actually surprised that those of you that have flown fighters don't know this. Surely, you've been to Red Flag, and have had interactions with USAF pilots, right?
HH-60H: You are typing many inaccuracies about FAIPs. They do not get their first choice after their FAIP tour; they compete with the other FAIPs. FAIPs coming out of the T-38 are also lined up for bombers, not just fighters. You did not mention the T-6/T-37, and those pilots get FAIP'd too.
Getting FAIP'd is a "positive"? Not sure what you mean, but in many cases, it is not, WRT career progression in your follow-on weapon system. As for you comment that FAIPs are cocky asses: how many do you know? Of course, I do note that, while most FAIP's are asses, your buddy is cool. What a coincidence. Right.
SemperGumbi: you're bashing on pilots doing multiple radar patterns? This, coming from a pilot that spends how many months in the T-45 bounce pattern? I'm assuming you're not a sergrad, and flew something in the fleet (curious, what did you fly), but either way, if you've got wings, you should know that FAIPs do NOT call themselves "fighter pilots". The majority of FAIPs are in the T-1 and T-6. Only T-38 FAIPs (and a small number of the T-6 FAIPs) will get fighter follow ons. Based on how you told the story, you weren't even there,... you heard it second hand from a Hornet friend. Hardly solid ground to say that "FAIPs call themselves fighter pilots".
A4sForever: what airline were you working for when that "cockpit vs flight deck" edict came down? That's pretty sad.
Now if y'all get so much enjoyment out of bashing the USAF, then have at it. Seems immature to me, but what do I know: I wave at other pilots when I see them.
But, try to at least keep your bashing factual.
Well, despite the name Airwarriors, this is primarily a Naval Aviation forum, so I'd expect there'd be some bashing of other services, whether it be warranted or just good natured fun.
Welcome to the site, read through some of the old posts, and you'll probably get a good idea of the atmosphere around here.
MasterBates
Well-Known Member
Typical AF homo..
...had to be said.
...had to be said.
But isn't there better things to waste energy on? Don't the people that do this understand that it sounds unprofessional on the radio? There are brevity words for a reason and playing word games just wastes bandwidth. You mention that you think it's childish (which isn't necessarily a bad thing) so I'm curious how widespread that sentiment is.
Perhaps you're not familiar w/ the Navy. The AF is a favorite whipping boy. As for waving...I agree, I'm not sure what the big deal there is.
Wow, that is a coincidence that you know nothing about me or my background.
How many do I know..... well several of them were my instructors in flight school, yes that's right I went through Phase I and II at Vance AFB, and most of them, particularly the U-2 wannabes were cocky asses.
If you actually chose reading comprehension over imagery collection, you would notice that my post mentioned nothing about a FAIP being positive WRT to career progression, just that you can rack up a lot of PIC time and instructor time, which can be a plus if you are looking to leave big blue, AND that your IP/flight cdrs have the trust and confidence in your abilities to do so. There are a couple other reading comprehension problems, but I have really don't have the time to waste.
Big deal if I left out bombers vs. fighters, this is Navy site and I wasn't going into the details here.
And as previously mentioned, him getting his first choice because he was a FAIP is how he explained it to me. You can call him a liar all you like.
sts
1. Welcome.
2. God made the Air Force so we would have someone to make fun of. You don't serve any other useful purpose so that must be it.
3. You must be a Captain, you sound like you know it all. I don't know the origin of the box/container program, but I can tell you that it IS a PC thing, I saw the e-mail from some knob USAF Colonel (redundant) in the CAOC in '96 during World War OSW.
4. Unbunch your panties and grow some skin. If you want to hang out in this ready room, then act like someone we would want to have in the ready room. If you don't like what is getting dished, then dish it back. Don't whine about it. We may not like you, but at least we will respect you.
Nose
gatordev: I think it's considered pretty silly outside of the pointy-nosed world. Yeah, I understand the USAF is a pretty fun target for the Sailors. That's fine. The Tomcat/Hornet/Hoover drivers I work with are pretty good at dishing out the banter. However, their IQ's seem about 100 points higher than the combined IQ's of a number of posters on this thread. You and a couple others here seem to be the only ones that can put out a decent post. Cheers.
HH-60: I guess you expect us to believe that since you went through UPT at Vance, that makes you an expert in FAIPs, right? You sound like a whining-lawyer-wannabee trying to go back and analyze every sentence you posted. Save your time. The point is you should stick to discussing something you know about,... HH-60's maybe? You know, I flew the HH-60 at Pax River back in June. 1.5 hours in the left seat. Am I qualified to start commenting on HH-60 pilot career paths?
And I'm not calling your buddy a liar. But the explanation he gave you was probably simplistic, and not so accurate. So, your buddy isn't a liar, and I would never call him one.
Nose: so you do know the background of head/box/sts, or you don't?? Which is it. Oh wait,... yes, you learned all about the AF from an email from some O-6. Impressive. Do you use the National Enquirer for your intel briefs? Well done.
"Unbunch my panties"? Probably something you Sailors wear in the Navy. However, you guys just keep yucking it up. This place seems more like Romper Room than a military pilot forum. My skin is fine. Judging from the replies to my initial posting, many of you should look in the mirror to make sure your rice-paper-thin skin hasn't gone. You'd probably bleed to death.
Standing by for the barrage of 5th grade insults and "I know this about the USAF 'cause I heard if from my skipper's wife's brother in law".
HH-60: I guess you expect us to believe that since you went through UPT at Vance, that makes you an expert in FAIPs, right? You sound like a whining-lawyer-wannabee trying to go back and analyze every sentence you posted. Save your time. The point is you should stick to discussing something you know about,... HH-60's maybe? You know, I flew the HH-60 at Pax River back in June. 1.5 hours in the left seat. Am I qualified to start commenting on HH-60 pilot career paths?
And I'm not calling your buddy a liar. But the explanation he gave you was probably simplistic, and not so accurate. So, your buddy isn't a liar, and I would never call him one.
Nose: so you do know the background of head/box/sts, or you don't?? Which is it. Oh wait,... yes, you learned all about the AF from an email from some O-6. Impressive. Do you use the National Enquirer for your intel briefs? Well done.
"Unbunch my panties"? Probably something you Sailors wear in the Navy. However, you guys just keep yucking it up. This place seems more like Romper Room than a military pilot forum. My skin is fine. Judging from the replies to my initial posting, many of you should look in the mirror to make sure your rice-paper-thin skin hasn't gone. You'd probably bleed to death.
Standing by for the barrage of 5th grade insults and "I know this about the USAF 'cause I heard if from my skipper's wife's brother in law".
Welcome aboard.
This might be the first place you have seen it, but there is a thing among the services called "interservice rivalry". It involves smack-talking, smart-ass comments, and general tomfoolery. Look it up on Wikipedia, if you like:
The Air Farce: Why is it the butt of so many jokes?
If you are looking for serious discussions on stuff, they do occur here.
But this place usually flies at Mock 5.0.
You've been warned.
Not sure how many other military aviation forums you participate in but, as previously mentioned, this is a Naval Aviation forum so you should expect some AF bashing to go along with the other discussions here. If you go over to Baseops.net, which is predominantly AF, you will find some Navy/Marine bashing there. If you look hard enough on this forum, you will find some Navy v Marine bashing, to go along with the ever-so-easy Coast Guard bashing. So, while it’s honorable to stick up for ones service with great zeal, there’s no reason to get defensive. If someone is spouting bouge (bad-gouge), then correct them on it and press. But a disagreement that leads to a big dick contest & name calling (both sides in this case) usually means the thread going downhill and eventually locked. No reason for that 'cause in the end we are all on the same team. Inter-service bashing has been around since the early days of military aviation (I enjoy partaking in it myself on occasion) but it shouldn’t lead to “real” arguments … that’s more gay than STS.
My technique, if anybody gives a shit ... I don't hit send on a message if I'm not willing to say it to the person's face that I'm responding to (this gun club we are in is very small).
Oh, and I normally wave on the flight line, even if it's AF ... guess I'm a homo
S/F
Well, I was going to steer clear of this little food fight but it is too hard to resist.........Plus, I wanted to give a little friendly advice and a quick fam before you got piled on.........
I worked with/for several U-2 drivers currently and in the recent past, including the current group commander at Beale, and I never found them to be arrogant pricks. On the contrary, they seemed to be among the most enthusiastic aviators I have ever met. And they have all been consummate professionals to boot. Your few posts on this board are not in line with what I experienced with Dragon Lady drivers so far in my career.........
Taking a few offhand comments by guys who are relating their personal experiences about several USAF practices and saying that they don't know sh!t, then proceeding to insult them is not the best way to introduce yourself here. If you hadn't caught a clue already the wings below the screen names means that they are professional Naval Aviators and/or Naval Flight Officers, that includes Marines and Coast Guardsmen. We have the whole gamut here, from helo drivers to fighter pilots with P-3 and E-6 guys in the mix, along with a few old hands/retirees who occasionally make a valuable contribution
. Even a few Army Helo bubbas stop by now and again. There are also a lot of flgiht students, midshipmen and wannabes here too, so you will get a mix of the inane to the semi-intelligent posts here. But for better or worse, and many people have noted this before, that this is a virtual Naval Aviation Ready Room/Wardroom. That is with all the goods and bads, but it especially includes the joking and the merciless put-downs. You can't take a lot of what is said here too seriously, it is the internet after all, but to enter the fight without being fully briefed and then firing off randomly at whomever looks like a good target is not the wisest course of action. Targeting our colleagues in light blue is a favorite pastime and comes up often, and the same thing happens at Baseops.net (the closest USAF equivalent to this site) with the Navy. This is usually in good fun, since there is plenty about our own services that is screwed up......But this is a Naval Aviation site........
We don't know who you are and only have you posts and a short bio to go on, and coupled with a recent experience with a faker in the recent past claiming to be a USAF F-15E/MH-53 driver, you are not off to the best of starts to be a valuable contributor of this site. To have a U-2 driver be a regular on this site would be a very good thing, but to have an jerk is not. We already have our resident grumpy old men........
Here's to hoping for a happy ending.......
Your advice is noted. Thank you. My initial read on this thread was that the comments seemed pretty over-the-top,... like some folks were really consumed with it. It was an observation and that's all.
I'll try to contribute by being one of your resident experts, albeit a Naval Aviation outsider, when it comes to discussions involving the USAF or any other subject I might have some knowledge on.
So, if I came in like a bull in a china shop, well there was obviously a better way to do it. As a guest here, I will enjoy the banter, do the best I can to ignore the b.s., correct errors, and be a contributing aviator.
With that said, thanks for the last couple of posts. Hope to see y'all on a different thread.
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