Hot water to deice?!

[mtsupilot09]

Saturday night there were 4 jets that started to ice up on the ramp of my FBO. We don't have deice capabilities. We eventually got them in a hangar to thaw, but one of the flight crews (a Citation Sovereign) requested that we put hot water on the wings to melt the frost. I explained that hot water actually freezes faster than cold water and that it would almost certainly create a layer of clear ice. The captain had me do it anyway, so away I went, filled up buckets with hot water from the coffee maker and proceeded to pour it on the wings. And, like I thought, it created a layer of clear ice. This surprised the pilot. I was floored at his lack of knowledge/planning for weather. I wanted to say to him, "Isn't it kind of a big part of your job to plan ahead for the weather?" No, frost/ice is not forecasted, but temperature is.

 

[xj220]

Weird. I know you can actually polish frost though.

 

[RadicalDude]

Eh, not necessarily true.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mpemba_effect

 

[rrpilot]

Weird. I know you can actually polish frost though.

No longer true as of February 2010, new rules coming that prohibit frost polishing.

http://www.aopa.org/training/articles/2009/091202frost.html?WT.mc_id=091204epilot&WT.mc_sect=gan

 

[Uncle Fester]

You'd really be surprised - and apparently have been surprised - by how little knowledge most pilots have about stuff like that. "Icing: it's bad, stay out of it, and if you've got it, get rid of it" is the extent of most instruction. Physics of icing? Pfft, fuggedaboutit.

 

[FlyinRock]

Why is the fuel warning light flickering? I thought you said the line guys put fuel in both tanks......
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What the hell is that cement block doing hanging off the wing tie down? Didn't you untie the airplane?
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I don't give a shit what you think...I'M THE PILOT IN COMMAND.
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Didn't you check the weather last night? I was busy at the lounge. Good thing they woke me up this morning or I might have missed the crew bus.
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Why is this damned yoke jerking back and forth?
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No one told me about that TFR!!
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AND HERES YOUR SIGN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Semper fi
Rocky

 

[BACONATOR]

The only two approved methods of de-icing for us are de-ice fluids or heating. NO water or "chipping" etc.

 

[usmarinemike]

There's a CRM lecture lurking somewhere in here. The only thing missing is a mishap.

 

[Jim123]

The only two approved methods of de-icing for us are de-ice fluids or heating. NO water or "chipping" etc.

Hehehe.... that works well enough on your car windshield while you're warming your car up in your own driveway, even if the water refreezes you can keep hosing it down and it will all eventually thaw. But airplane = big difference.

@mtsupilot09, hopefully your Citation pilot had a quiet, embarrassing "duh" moment with himself.

 

[mtsupilot09]

Yeah, I guess C680 type ratings don't cover winter ops. Must have been based in Florida or SoCal.

 

[Uncle Fester]

Hehehe.... that works well enough on your car windshield while you're warming your car up in your own driveway, even if the water refreezes you can keep hosing it down and it will all eventually thaw. But airplane = big difference.

Heh. Funny, this same thing came up one night on the Boat. JOPA was watching The Deadliest Catch, one of the episodes where the boats are taking freezing spray and the fishermen are outside banging the ice off with sledges. One of the pilots says, "Why don't they just spray it down with heated water?" Told that would just make more ice, he says, "But it works on my car..."

 

[Godspeed]

The phenomenon explained:

http://library.thinkquest.org/C008537/cool/freeze/freeze.html

 

[RedFive]

Last time I had frost I went to the gas station across the street and bought two gallons of deicing windshield washer fluid. Approved or not, it works

 

[Pepe]

Hehehe.... that works well enough on your car windshield while you're warming your car up in your own driveway, even if the water refreezes you can keep hosing it down and it will all eventually thaw. But airplane = big difference.

@mtsupilot09, hopefully your Citation pilot had a quiet, embarrassing "duh" moment with himself.

Doesn't that end up scattering the window from the difference in temperatures?

 

[Godspeed]

Doesn't that end up scattering the window from the difference in temperatures?

It certainly can... Had a dumbass friend back home in High School that threw boiling water on their windshield.... Didn't work out too well. I think you'd mitigate the risk by using 'luke warm' water, but still, gotta be careful.