• Please take a moment and update your account profile. If you have an updated account profile with basic information on why you are on Air Warriors it will help other people respond to your posts. How do you update your profile you ask?

    Go here:

    Edit Account Details and Profile

Commercial Aviation Required Reading

MIDNJAC

is clara ship
pilot
Here is a sub topic for the guys in the show, or further along in the process than me.......any recommended books for the (hopefully) transitioning to 121 metal guy? I already have Aero for NA's, Everything explained for (to?) the professional pilot, as well as some random FAA advisory circulars. Anything beyond that to put into the study bank for deployment?
 

webmaster

The Grass is Greener!
pilot
Site Admin
Contributor

webmaster

The Grass is Greener!
pilot
Site Admin
Contributor
Interview prep I used Emerald Coast Consulting. They have reading material and audio prep that is excellent. I also used them to review my resume.

 

scoolbubba

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
Here is a sub topic for the guys in the show, or further along in the process than me.......any recommended books for the (hopefully) transitioning to 121 metal guy? I already have Aero for NA's, Everything explained for (to?) the professional pilot, as well as some random FAA advisory circulars. Anything beyond that to put into the study bank for deployment?

Flying the line Vol 1 and 2.

Having never had a union before, you might find the relationship between whatever company and the union kind of awkward at first. You will figure out rapidly where your bread is buttered as soon as you get on the line and deal with scheduling vs contract admin. It isn't personal, it's just business. The company wants you to make as many widgets as you can and pay you as little as they possibly can; the union wants you to get a market rate for your productivity and value produced and advance their contract as much as they can with each cycle of bargaining.

Flying the Line gives the background on how ALPA came to be and its wins and losses along the way. Even if you don't end up at an ALPA carrier, it's worth it to see what the guys who went ahead of you dealt with to get where the profession is today.
 

dustydog

Registered User
pilot
Along the lines of Flying the Line, read Hard Landing for a good history about the volitility of the industry. It’s not going to prep you for an interview but it should be required reading for anyone who wants the go to the show.
 

dustydog

Registered User
pilot

MIDNJAC

is clara ship
pilot
Along the lines of Flying the Line, read Hard Landing for a good history about the volitility of the industry. It’s not going to prep you for an interview but it should be required reading for anyone who wants the go to the show.
I did read that on TSTA. Good few hundred pages of info. As for Sheppard, I'm crushing my life right now with that stuff, getting ready for the written this week or next. What did you guys use to get ready for the knowledge test portion of interview? That and Pro pilots?
 

wink

VS NFO. Blue and Gold Officer
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Flying the line Vol 1 and 2.

Having never had a union before, you might find the relationship between whatever company and the union kind of awkward at first. You will figure out rapidly where your bread is buttered as soon as you get on the line and deal with scheduling vs contract admin. It isn't personal, it's just business. The company wants you to make as many widgets as you can and pay you as little as they possibly can; the union wants you to get a market rate for your productivity and value produced work as little as possible at the highest pay rate and stay in the most comfortable hotel imaginable within walking distance of a great bar and several restaurant options, get 6+ weeks vacation ( see above, work as little as possible), full pay disability benefits, zero $$ contribution for health and life insurance and advance their contract as much as they can with each cycle of bargaining.

Flying the Line gives the background on how ALPA came to be and its wins and losses along the way. Even if you don't end up at an ALPA carrier, it's worth it to see what the guys who went ahead of you dealt with to get where the profession is today.
I fixed it in the interest of honesty ;). The union doesn't give a rats ass about market rates. It is all talk. They want as much as they can get. EVERY contract negotiation begins with a demand for market rates. It doesn't matter how much you are getting payed or if you are even the best paid in the industry. To the union, market rates are whatever they are demanding that cycle. As for productivity, like all good unions, they limit our productivity so more pilots have to be hired and grow the seniority list to make opportunities for us all. I get it. One mans productivity is another man's unsafe pilot pushing. I love 10-12 hour layovers, cushy Heavenly Bed and Happy Hour. But if productivity was what the union cared about we would be working to the FARs and staying at airport hotels five minutes from the terminal.

Not being critical of airline unions. The early guys really were pioneers in safety. I want as much as I can get too. Lets just keep it real. There isn't much altruism in the airline union business. It is, in fact, a business just like Envoy, UAL or JetBlue. Delta's CEO aims to maximize profits for the shareholders, Delta's ALPA MEC aims to maximize a complete benefits package (pay, insurance, travel, vacation, etc) for their shareholders (union members).
 

scoolbubba

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
Just looking at some of the guys who lost their asses and took major concessionary contracts to help keep their companies afloat, I don’t blame anyone who is a rabid unionist.

A former furloughee from another airline who was working in our training center recounted an encounter with a chief at his former carrier, post bankruptcy:

‘you know you’re missing your hat?’
“Yea, it’s probably hiding with my pension.”

Everyone is making money now; that might not be the case in the future. Get what you can while you can and sock away for a rainy day.
 

wink

VS NFO. Blue and Gold Officer
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Just looking at some of the guys who lost their asses and took major concessionary contracts to help keep their companies afloat, I don’t blame anyone who is a rabid unionist.

A former furloughee from another airline who was working in our training center recounted an encounter with a chief at his former carrier, post bankruptcy:

‘you know you’re missing your hat?’
“Yea, it’s probably hiding with my pension.”

Everyone is making money now; that might not be the case in the future. Get what you can while you can and sock away for a rainy day.
You are looking at one of those guys who took a 30% pay cut to stay out of bankruptcy. It was the right thing to do at the time. But after every other major airline had been through bankruptcy, some more than once, our time came anyway. Hard to compete with competitors that get released from many of their financial obligations and walk away from pensions through bankruptcy, and you are still paying full freight to each and every creditor. I was never furloughed, or lost much seniority in the many mergers and acquisitions that have occurred over my career. But I am going on 24 months over two periods in disability where in my benefits amount to a 60%+ pay cut and no opportunity to fund a retirement barely two years away. I also spent a quarter of my career on B scale. I know what a union can do for you. I know how they operate. I am thankful for the improvements they have brought to my career. I appreciate the volunteers. But once section 6 negations get underway, Both side lie and misrepresent like the big dogs in DC.
Isn’t that, by definition, market rate?
I'd say no. Market rates are set by a free market with participants free to charge what they want and pay what they want. With two major unions controlling negations for the vast majority of pilots in America, and a seniority system that discourages pilots from individually withholding their labor and taking it to someplace that treats them better, it isn't really a free market in labor. And we can not forget that what makes unions effective, collective action to include strikes, makes them more powerful in the short term then the market for airline tickets. More to the point, given what I said, your post indicates you think market rates are simply what you ask for. That is without question wrong. Market rates are the most common price for a particular good or service based on quality, supply, demand, and service. If I am a baker and have bread to sell, I can put whatever price on it I want. If I put a price of $21.00 a loaf, that isn't market rates. I will be reminded of that when the landlord kicks me out of my building for not paying rent because I am not selling bread. What I get paid by the airline is not based on the quality of my work, and only loosely on supply of pilots, since none of us are leaving for another airline due to seniority, or getting out of the business. The baker can fire rude counter help and bakers that make crappy products. He can lower his price. Unions either prevent, or effectively prevent those vital elements of a free market. And, with multiyear union contracts the labor market, as it is, is effectively frozen with rates set for years by a piece of paper and not market forces that may vary over the course of the contract.
 
Top