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Active shooter at NAS Pensacola

scoolbubba

Brett327 gargles ballsacks
pilot
Contributor
And before any of you freak out, look, I'd love to have more small arms training and be more proficient, especially for my squadron. I think armed watchstanders would be a great idea and have the man, train, and equipment for it. But that's not going to happen. It does cost money. To be at a proficient level enough to stop an active shooter you need significant training, and recurrent training to be able to keep up that skill. I think as military members we should have a fighting mindset and be able to use firearms regularly, but that's not the primary focus of OUR profession. We fight with aircraft, warriors of the air if you will (possibly airwarriors some might say). We have infantry and SOF that receive extensive firearm training since that's THEIR job.

I agree, our safety and security is important, but you have to be realistic, as well. Shootings do happen and they're awful when they do, but they're rare. I'd rather divert the resourses that would be used arm us on base to preventing mishaps (whether it be more training, hours, parts, etc.) as I'd argue we've lost more personnel over the last severals to those than shootings.

The guys who got IA’d to convoy duty in Iraq should have just told the morons at BUPERS that they weren’t ground pounders, they were warriors of the sky! They could have reiterated that when they did their pre-mob training. I bet it would have worked.
 

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
And yet the Marines somehow make it work.
Let the Marines or cops protect us. They are dumb enough to accept the risk of scary guns.

Plus Brett isn’t liable for bad things that happen to them. He’s also not liable if someone murders sailors in his squadron. Getting fired for a negligent discharge or a fucked up watch is much more risk than he’s willing to accept.
 

xj220

Will fly for food.
pilot
Contributor
The threat of an armed duty is enough of a deterrent to make a potential adversary think twice or pick another soft target. That’s basic ATFP 101. There is no such thing as “currency” for handling a damn weapon. That should be instinctive for members of the U.S military. It’s not an aircraft, or safety metric to account. It’s a basic concept of military service.

Maybe, or maybe not. Someone goes off the deep end they target the armed watch first then they have free range. And to actually use a firearm, no, currency isn’t required. To be effective and more than just a person with a gun, yes it does. Accuracy takes training and currency. You need to be able to quick draw and aim the firearm, especially in a stressful situation. You need training to move through spaces to get to the target and not accidentally shoot someone else.
 

xj220

Will fly for food.
pilot
Contributor
The guys who got IA’d to convoy duty in Iraq should have just told the morons at BUPERS that they weren’t ground pounders, they were warriors of the sky! They could have reiterated that when they did their pre-mob training. I bet it would have worked.

Those guys who went IA also went through a lot of training before going out the door, to include firearm training. There, their job wasn’t to fly but to support their ground duties. Different job.
 

Hotdogs

I don’t care if I hurt your feelings
pilot
Maybe, or maybe not. Someone goes off the deep end they target the armed watch first then they have free range. And to actually use a firearm, no, currency isn’t required. To be effective and more than just a person with a gun, yes it does. Accuracy takes training and currency. You need to be able to quick draw and aim the firearm, especially in a stressful situation. You need training to move through spaces to get to the target and not accidentally shoot someone else.

Just stop dude. This shit isn’t rocket science. An armed duty is better than being a fish in a barrel waiting to be shot.
 

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
Maybe, or maybe not. Someone goes off the deep end they target the armed watch first then they have free range. And to actually use a firearm, no, currency isn’t required. To be effective and more than just a person with a gun, yes it does. Accuracy takes training and currency. You need to be able to quick draw and aim the firearm, especially in a stressful situation. You need training to move through spaces to get to the target and not accidentally shoot someone else.

Just read hotdog’s post again. You’re lost.
And what is your point? Is it the zeros across the top? Zero incidents, zero fatalities this year?

Or the part that shows three fatalities over six years due to on duty negligent discharges? Two examples are given of the three, and one was in combat and the other was while maneuvering on a live fire range.

I guess I missed all the duties mowing down their fellow Marines like they’re John Wick.
 

xj220

Will fly for food.
pilot
Contributor
Ok, you’re probably right, I am overthinking it. I just don’t see the culture shift necessary to occur for it to happen, happen.
 

Hotdogs

I don’t care if I hurt your feelings
pilot
If an aircraft was capable of being manufactured with an ejection seat but wasn’t procured with one, and the explanation was because “Aviators will forget to seat their pins and it may get them killed, So in order to prevent that we will just not install the ejection seat because it’s unlikely he’ll need to use it anyway.”

That’s how stupid your logic sounds right now.
 

UInavy

Registered User
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
If an aircraft was capable of being manufactured with an ejection seat but wasn’t procured with one, and the explanation was because “Aviators will forget to seat their pins and it may get them killed, So in order to prevent that we will just not install the ejection seat because it’s unlikely he’ll need to use it anyway.”

That’s how stupid your logic sounds right now.
Yep. You’ve got me. Merry Christmas.
 
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