What was/is your light at the end of the tunnel?

[MarsOrBust]

Context: Marine currently in Primary as an SNA. Commissioned via NROTC. Unsure of what platform I want to fly. No prior flight time other than IFS. I've combed through the "Consolidated Advice for Primary" thread and the “Thinking of DORing” thread and they were pretty helpful. Please link other ones you think might be particularly helpful.

I understand training crushes a lot of people in a lot of different ways. For some it's an oppressive on-wing, op-tempo, relationships, studying, a bad flight or series of flights, personal issues, COVID restrictions, you guys know the list.

For me, I think I've been dealing with it OK, no better or worse than anyone else I think. Flying hasn't been excessively challenging to me and I've been performing decently. I'm anthro'd out of jets so I'm not freaking out about grades (too much). I get to live a pretty nice life all things considered. I know my job is cool and that flying is a privilege many would kill to have. However I've really had a rough time being motivated throughout training. The life that lays before me (assuming I complete training) is one filled with a lot of doom and gloom as I've been looking at it.

The other day I solo-ed for the first time and I seriously don't think I liked it as much as I should have. It was cool, but I was definitely shitting my pants for a good portion of the flight and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't scared for a bit. "Did I just overspeed my flaps? Of course I didn't, I've brought them up tons of times. Or did I?" "This is really congested airspace, when am I going to get my call in? Shit, I'm already at the numbers but some asshole on the ground won't stop asking to move beyond the hold short, I need to get cleared to break! TCAS is going off again, where's that PEL traffic? Fuck! I missed my time to make my call." "Where's that TCAS hit?" "Shit I'm way off course rules right now".

So, in essence, I got way more freaked out than I anticipated I'd be. Cue "well if that freaks you out, imagine this…” I know there is more in store for me. I think I just need to stick with it to get more experience and more comfortable with being uncomfortable. I did enjoy parts of it, my basic airwork was tighter at some points than it usually is and it definitely built some confidence that I could safely-ish operate the plane. But now I'm trying to figure out if my experience told me "Jets probably aren't for you" or "aviation isn't for you". I have no intention of DORing any time soon but I feel like I'm blindly pouring effort into something I'm not sure I'm into - like continuing to date someone you're too scared to break up with because “it might get better”.

I should say that I didn't go for this job to have a "cushy" stress free life. I get it. No matter what I do I'm always going to have parts of my job that I don't like/are stressful - that's life. What I'm asking about is the evolution of comfort in the air throughout this program - isn't flying supposed to be "the good part"?

I have a good group of friends and my onwing is cool so I intend on reaching out to them about this. What do you guys think? TL;DR Does it get better? If your motivation shifted during flight school, how did it and how did you handle it? What was your "light at the end of the tunnel"? When did this job "click" with you and made you think "this is right for me"? When did your skills and abilities outpace the emerging new challenges of flying and "fighting" your aircraft?

 

[SynixMan]

Certainly don't think you're weird for not liking your Solo. I think I did a million gas/gauges checks on my solos, constantly worried something bad was gonna happen or I would fuck up and get sent home. Call it a healthy fear of death. I also realized then and there that I didn't want jets (not that I had jet grades).

I really didn't like Primary until the second half of instruments when some shit "clicked" for me, and even then not until INAV out and ins and my CCX where the IPs started to treat me more like a future wingman and less like an annoyance.

Advanced was awesome, and it got better from there as I learned what I was doing and started to see the bigger picture. Don't get me wrong, I arguably worked the hardest in my life when I was grinding for quals/upgrades in the fleet, but it felt like accomplishing something significant when I got there.

Keep the faith, it does get better.

 

[taxi1]

I think I just need to stick with it to get more experience and more comfortable with being uncomfortable.

Wise words.

I recommend you trust the person who chose to go into aviation a bunch of months ago (you) and just see it through, staring down at your feet one foot in the front of the other until your shins hit the podium at the winging ceremony. So to speak. You won't know for sure if you made the right or wrong decision until you get there. So trust yourself.

 

[Meyerkord]

Primary sucks. Advanced sucks slightly less. FRS sucks a lot less. Keep your head up and talk to the people ahead of you if you know any. You're definitely not alone. I had the same thoughts when I was going through Primary too.

 

[Waveoff]

What I will add, is if you are having serious serious doubts about your future or the program, definitely find a cool IP or one you trust to talk to. My flight partner during the early stages of INAV primary was getting slammed with early AM brief after another and one bad event lead to another and he was spiraling. Luckily his IP on the 4th or 5th straight day recognized his demeanor and they had a good talk about the future. That IP worked with ops to get him a sanity break and calm his nerves.

Long story short, the dude made his way through primary, advanced, and the FRS without problem after that and for all I know is doing fine. Uou may not get that kind of treatment, but there are people out there that care, that aren't nameless faces behind a computer screen. You're already doing a good thing by asking questions.

 

[Mirage]

Fake it till you make it!

I'm not joking.

 

[Swanee]

Context: Marine currently in Primary as an SNA. Commissioned via NROTC. Unsure of what platform I want to fly. No prior flight time other than IFS. I've combed through the "Consolidated Advice for Primary" thread and the “Thinking of DORing” thread and they were pretty helpful. Please link other ones you think might be particularly helpful.

I understand training crushes a lot of people in a lot of different ways. For some it's an oppressive on-wing, op-tempo, relationships, studying, a bad flight or series of flights, personal issues, COVID restrictions, you guys know the list.

For me, I think I've been dealing with it OK, no better or worse than anyone else I think. Flying hasn't been excessively challenging to me and I've been performing decently. I'm anthro'd out of jets so I'm not freaking out about grades (too much). I get to live a pretty nice life all things considered. I know my job is cool and that flying is a privilege many would kill to have. However I've really had a rough time being motivated throughout training. The life that lays before me (assuming I complete training) is one filled with a lot of doom and gloom as I've been looking at it.

The other day I solo-ed for the first time and I seriously don't think I liked it as much as I should have. It was cool, but I was definitely shitting my pants for a good portion of the flight and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't scared for a bit. "Did I just overspeed my flaps? Of course I didn't, I've brought them up tons of times. Or did I?" "This is really congested airspace, when am I going to get my call in? Shit, I'm already at the numbers but some asshole on the ground won't stop asking to move beyond the hold short, I need to get cleared to break! TCAS is going off again, where's that PEL traffic? Fuck! I missed my time to make my call." "Where's that TCAS hit?" "Shit I'm way off course rules right now".

So, in essence, I got way more freaked out than I anticipated I'd be. Cue "well if that freaks you out, imagine this…” I know there is more in store for me. I think I just need to stick with it to get more experience and more comfortable with being uncomfortable. I did enjoy parts of it, my basic airwork was tighter at some points than it usually is and it definitely built some confidence that I could safely-ish operate the plane. But now I'm trying to figure out if my experience told me "Jets probably aren't for you" or "aviation isn't for you". I have no intention of DORing any time soon but I feel like I'm blindly pouring effort into something I'm not sure I'm into - like continuing to date someone you're too scared to break up with because “it might get better”.

I should say that I didn't go for this job to have a "cushy" stress free life. I get it. No matter what I do I'm always going to have parts of my job that I don't like/are stressful - that's life. What I'm asking about is the evolution of comfort in the air throughout this program - isn't flying supposed to be "the good part"?

I have a good group of friends and my onwing is cool so I intend on reaching out to them about this. What do you guys think? TL;DR Does it get better? If your motivation shifted during flight school, how did it and how did you handle it? What was your "light at the end of the tunnel"? When did this job "click" with you and made you think "this is right for me"? When did your skills and abilities outpace the emerging new challenges of flying and "fighting" your aircraft?

Here's the thing about military flight training- you're never comfortable when you're up for a solo, or doing something new. If you were, then you've been overtrained for the task. Eventually some things become more comfortable, and even fun. Others will continue to be stressful and difficult- but those things are difficult and stressful.

It doesn't get easier, you just get better.


I always had one rule- find at least a couple of seconds for a quick breath, a look around, and a thought to yourself that, "Holy fucking shit, I'm getting paid to do this!" It's something that, until a little over 100 years ago, people could only dream of doing.

One of the things I miss most about the manned world is popping through an overcast layer on a shitty, rainy day or night, and seeing the sun and the clear sky, or seeing every star in the sky and the milky way on a moonless night. Or playing tailchase and cloud surfing on the first go of the morning on a weather recce. Everything else was work.

 

[HSMPBR]

This will sound familiar to the others, but why not add some reassurance? I chose helicopters for the purpose of getting through flight training as quickly as possible. Did not like primary. Did not like helo advanced. Absolutely loved the FRS and have been intravenously consuming community kool-aid since then (I’m still not taking the bonus though ?).

I think it is normal to feel like, “I’m supposed to love this and think it’s really fun, but I don’t.” Just treat it like an important job that needs a great deal of your focus and effort, succeed, and you will find your groove.

 

[squorch2]

BLUF: primary sucks cause you’re learning how to learn while learning - you get better+faster as your career progresses.

• Primary clicked after instrument check ride.
• Advanced clicked during failed card sim.
• FRS wasn’t a huge deal - likely unique to that time and place tho.
• fleet tour clicked after getting functional check pilot - again, likely unique to that time and place.
• IP tour clicked after first CCX
  

Also - it is perfectly okay if you don’t find flying to be your thing.

better to find that out in primary than advanced, FRS, or fleet tour.

 

[Pags]

A few bulletized thoughts:

Flying in the fleet is a totally different type of flying all together. And it's much better than flight school.

But, flying isn't for everyone and that's ok. But I'd recommend enduring flight school because its kind of meant to suck.

It's also ok to be not overcome with joy during a solo. Its good that you're thinking about all the details because that's the attention to detail that will keep you alive. At some point you'll be able to compartmentalize or live with it a bit better. But it will come back and hopefully be dealt with during your career. First events of any type always left me feeling uncomfortable but that waned with time. The first time you sign off an aircraft as FCF complete you worry, the first time you take new guys to the boat you'll be worried, etc.

To continue with Squorch's format which I like:
-Primary clicked during PA solos.
-advanced clicked during tactics flights (learning to hover SUCKED)
-HAC clicked somewhere into HAC cruise

I recall having a similar conversation with one of my 2Ps following night dirt landings:
2P: when do you get as comfortable as you were last night instructing dirt landings?
Me: I wasn't comfortable last night. It was my first time and that shit is scary. But I'm glad I pulled off being cool under pressure.
That guy screened for command.

Summary: it's ok to be uncomfortable and not loving it. You have to figure out how to handle that. Those coping skills will serve you well in many other areas of life outside of the cockpit.

 

[Dontcallmegump]

TL;DR Does it get better?

There's a ton of rock solid advice in here, so I wont echo it, ill just toss my 2 cents in.

I've wanted to fly for the navy my whole life, I'm literally "living the dream" and I had way more bad days in primary than good. 50/50 in advanced, standby for the FRS fraction...

Primary (especially contacts/ aero and imo forms) sucks, is hard and just feels bad most all the time, every day. Its something to get through.
Now, even though every miniscule action you even think about is in your ATJ, Advanced is a fresh start to do things better. Know that right now, the suck and struggle is a lot of learning that will pay off when you get to try again with new faces in a new place and do it better the next time.

Lastly, no one belongs in flight training, you have to fight to just exist day to day and that made me feel like it was all some big mistake. Getting through that stuff in your head to preform is part of developing into what the program wants you to be, even though (almost) no one ever talks about it. Its all as much as mind games, whether self imposed or not, as much as it is educational.

Stick with it, you'll be amazed what you can do.

 

[croakerfish]

I felt pretty similar to you. My onwing was a dick (I’ve now been an onwing instructor myself so that is now a qualified opinion), I was constantly airsick and struggled through without meds or spin chair adaptation, failed my pre-check and almost had a meltdown driving in for my re-fly.
I didn’t like flying particularly. I liked the challenge and the intensity of trying to survive the program but there was no “wheeee” feeling. I did love my solo a lot, but it was for the thrill of victory that I got from making it that far.

That all changed when I got to my first flight in a helicopter. I was laughing like an idiot. I knew instantly I’d found my place.

That “doom and gloom” you mention where everyone is saying stuff like “it only gets harder” or “wait until you have a gRoUd jOb” always aggravated me. Will you have a higher workload with long hours and less time to prepare for your syllabus events in the fleet? Absolutely. Is it as stressful as flight school? Not even close.
Yes, the standard goes up. Obviously you need a higher order of skills to land a formation of tactical aircraft in a dusty LZ on NVDs than you do to fly instruments in a prop plane. Did your dad tell you it only gets harder to ride a bike with no training wheels when you were learning to pedal a tricycle? You just keep repeating the formula that gets you through Primary and it gets smoother every time.

 

[squorch2]

different type of flying all together

nice

 

[Pags]

I felt pretty similar to you. My onwing was a dick (I’ve now been an onwing instructor myself so that is now a qualified opinion), I was constantly airsick and struggled through without meds or spin chair adaptation, failed my pre-check and almost had a meltdown driving in for my re-fly.
I didn’t like flying particularly. I liked the challenge and the intensity of trying to survive the program but there was no “wheeee” feeling. I did love my solo a lot, but it was for the thrill of victory that I got from making it that far.

That all changed when I got to my first flight in a helicopter. I was laughing like an idiot. I knew instantly I’d found my place.

That “doom and gloom” you mention where everyone is saying stuff like “it only gets harder” or “wait until you have a gRoUd jOb” always aggravated me. Will you have a higher workload with long hours and less time to prepare for your syllabus events in the fleet? Absolutely. Is it as stressful as flight school? Not even close.
Yes, the standard goes up. Obviously you need a higher order of skills to land a formation of tactical aircraft in a dusty LZ on NVDs than you do to fly instruments in a prop plane. Did your dad tell you it only gets harder to ride a bike with no training wheels when you were learning to pedal a tricycle? You just keep repeating the formula that gets you through Primary and it gets smoother every time.

The amount your required monkey skills and basic airmanship increase with each step goes down (smaller steps) for each bit of training. Yes, landing on NVDs as a section in the dirt is harder than BIs but by the time you get there it'll be easier to do because you're learning fewer things at once. When I had 1000+ hours and learned how to tow in a 60 it was challenging but not as challenging as doing oscar patterns in the 57 or Fam 3 when you don't even know how to talk on the radios.

Also the ground job thing is silly. Your first ground job is usually a nothing job that allows you to focus on getting qualified.

 

[Gatordev]

...it was challenging but not as challenging as doing oscar patterns in the 57...

There's a couple things in life that will drive me to setup in a book suppository building with a high-powered rifle like Ned Flanders. Oscar patterns is one of those things...in any airframe.