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The Great Civil War thread split of April 2020

Pags

Pope of Chili Town
pilot
Freaking politician in uniform that man was.
Which would've been tolerable if he had been a fighter. I mean you can't even say he was a winner or a loser because he didn't even try. Burnside and Hooker were losers, but they at least tried.
 

nittany03

FUBIJAR
pilot
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Which would've been tolerable if he had been a fighter. I mean you can't even say he was a winner or a loser because he didn't even try. Burnside and Hooker were losers, but they at least tried.
He overinflated his intel reports in his own head; that was part of the problem. He was convinced Lee was going to somehow bring up the equivalent to the Grande freaking Armeé, when in reality what he saw in front of him was what he was up against. Exhibit A: Antietam.
 

Pags

Pope of Chili Town
pilot
He overinflated his intel reports in his own head; that was part of the problem. He was convinced Lee was going to somehow bring up the equivalent to the Grande freaking Armeé, when in reality what he saw in front of him was what he was up against. Exhibit A: Antietam.
By all accounts the war should've been over by 1862. I've never seen a "what if Lee had taken Lincoln's offer" historical fiction but that's probably because it would be boring.

-Lee said yes, got a big army
-he's Lee, so he trounces the CSA at Bull Run, marches to Richmond and arrests Jeff Davis
-award ceremony, cake, and bug juice
 

nittany03

FUBIJAR
pilot
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
By all accounts the war should've been over by 1862. I've never seen a "what if Lee had taken Lincoln's offer" historical fiction but that's probably because it would be boring.

-Lee said yes, got a big army
-he's Lee, so he trounces the CSA at Bull Run, marches to Richmond and arrests Jeff Davis
-award ceremony, cake, and bug juice
Through some quirk of the Butterfly Effect, you can't buy Allen Edmonds dress shoes, but can buy Grant shoes. Or maybe horse saddles or purses or something.
 

Pags

Pope of Chili Town
pilot
Through some quirk of the Butterfly Effect, you can't buy Allen Edmonds dress shoes, but can buy Grant shoes. Or maybe horse saddles or purses or something.
Or perhaps Grant becomes a famous painter. Have you ever seen a Grant painting? I'm no art critic but I thought the ones I've seen were quite good. But apparently sketching was an important part of a West Point education at the time as officers were expected to ride out and be able to accurately recreate what they had seen since photography wasn't a thing yet
 

nittany03

FUBIJAR
pilot
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
It all comes down to the Bourbon you drink!
Reading Grant's bio by Ron Chernow was interesting. He apparently was an alcoholic, or at least a binge drinker. And he was a vociferous member of the temperance movement, partly because of his wife, but probably also because he was ashamed by that. He was initially driven to drink by being stuck on the Western frontier, separated from his family, under an asshole CO after the Mexican War. And he tried a few side hustles to earn money that failed. He never did have a very good record in business or finance, and seemed to be really gullible regarding get-rich-quick schemes.

But he also could control himself, and apparently only got hammered during lulls in the war when he knew he wasn't going to see combat. His chief of staff helped keep him on an even keel, defended his reputation to the world, and made sure when he did cut loose, it was when the Army wasn't endangered. They kind of managed his addiction as a team to keep it from threatening the war effort. In the field, Grant was always sober, and his drinking habits were exaggerated by his political enemies, both in uniform and out.
 
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IRfly

Registered User
None
Which would've been tolerable if he had been a fighter. I mean you can't even say he was a winner or a loser because he didn't even try. Burnside and Hooker were losers, but they at least tried.
Grant lost just as much, if not more, than both of them put together. Difference was, iirc, after getting beaten, his next orders were to continue marching south.
 
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