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Response from Navy Eye Doctor at NAMI

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virtu050

P-8 Bubba
pilot
Here are the responses I got from two Navy Eye Doctors regarding concern about the NAMI eye exam at OCS. Just FYI.

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Indeed the vision standards are no worse than 20/40 uncorrected. One area that must be considered is that we have ten letters on our Goodlite Charts. The Goodlite Chart is the only acceptable chart to use for aviation standards. Normally in a provider's office, you will be tested on a Snellen Chart. These charts can vary in accuracy.

You will usually be tested on the Armed Forces Vision Tester at MEPS. We use this tester for some requirements, but not for vision. In the military, we are tasked with maintaining certain standards. These standards are usually set by a working group. At NAMI, our requirement is to adhere to the standards in a professional manner. If you obviously miss two to three letters on the 20/40 Goodlite Chart, it does not meet the standard of 20/40-0. In comparison, in civilian practices, this may be recorded as 20/40.

At NAMI, two to three eye care professionals will evaluate applicants that may have problems meeting standards. This allows for an unbiased decision to the findings. If one provider finds that your results are 20/40-2, and another provider finds that your findings are 20/40-0, we use the second findings for determining your acceptance. In addition, if you are squinting to see the 20/40 line, then you are definitely not 20/40.

The field of aviation is a strict community. Vision is only one of many different facets of standards aviators have to maintain on a daily basis. Miss one procedure on a emergency procedure checklist, and you may have a mishap. We can not clear you for adequate flight if you can only do 70% of the emergency procedures. The same holds true for vision, hearing, speech, cardiology, etc.

Finally, evals to be accepted at OCS are not evals to be accepted for aviation. You can enter OCS with less than 20/40 vision. You can not enter the SNA program with less than 20/40 uncorrected vision.

I hope that this helps to clear the air of the "horror stories" that you have heard of.

Very Respectfully,

LCDR, MSC USN
Aerospace Optometrist
Naval Aerospace Medical Institute


-----Original Message-----
Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 8:51 AM
Cc: 'Cooley, Stephen LCDR'
Subject: RE: NAMI Exam at OCS


You will always hear stories from other personnel but I always caution people to take what they hear in perspective. I have actually performed vision screenings at NOMI and can address my experience and I have included LCDR who is at NAMI right now to further comment if necessary. I can tell you that every individual screener does their best to ensure you meet the standards. If someone "let's you slide" for being "close" to the standard they are doing you no favors because the NAMI personnel screening SNA candidates WILL follow the prescribed guidelines that are quoted directly from the Manual of the Medical Department, Article 15-65, page 15-47, Change 118 dated 20 Aug 2002 and read as follows:

(6) Standards for Aviation Personnel

NOTE: In general, applicants for aviation programs are held to stricter physical standards than trained and designated personnel
and will be less likely to be recommended for waivers. Refer to the Aeromedical Reference and Waiver Guide for specific information.

(a) Disqualifying Conditions for all Aviation Duty.
Personnel must meet the physical standards for general military service in the Navy as a prerequisite before consideration for any
aviation duty. In addition to the disqualifying defects listed in MANMED Chapter 15, Section III (Physical Standards), the following shall
be considered disqualifying for all aviation duty:

(7) Standards for Specific Categories of Aviation Personnel

(a) Class I Personnel

(1) Service Group 1. In addition to the standards in Chapter 15, Section III (Physical Standards) and the general aviation standards,
Service Group I aviators must meet the following standards:

(a) Vision

1. Distant Visual Acuity. 20/100 or better each eye uncorrected, corrected to 20/20 or better each eye. The first time distant visual
acuity of less than 20/20 is noted a manifest refraction (not cycloplegic) shall be performed recording the correction required for
the aviator to see 20/20 in each eye (all letters correct on the 20/20 line). A dilated fundus exam is required if visual acuity
cannot be corrected to 20/20.

You may note that the standard for corrected visual acuity is ALL letters read correctly (20/20 -0) which means you will read a line of 10 letters and cannot miss ANY! Yes this is a strict standard but has been enforced for many years and is not supposed to be higher than screening exams elsewhere. The same applies to uncorrected vision standards.

As I said before, if you were just getting by at the 20/40 uncorrected standard you may have problems at the final qualifying exam. Civilian and/or MEPS physical screeners are not always acutely aware of the military aviation standard and may allow you to pass when you are borderline as a candidate (i.e. may allow you to pass when you miss one letter whereas you cannot miss any letters at Pensacola). I know it is not the brief answer that perhaps you were looking for but you have to understand the background before you understand the answer. I hope this helps.

V/R,
O.D., F.A.A.O.
CDR, MSC, USN
Assistant Specialty Leader for Navy Optometry
 

BYSun

Registered User
Wow! Great Gouge. Thanks Virtu.

Bryce

In the end it all comes down to a simple choice, get busy livin' or get busy dyin' - The Shawshank Redemption
 

webmaster

The Grass is Greener!
pilot
Site Admin
Contributor
virtu050, good info, I went ahead and edited your post, had to remove the names and phone numbers, I have been advised by the legal types and infosec that that is a no no and could get me in trouble.
 

Jim

Registered User
what exactly is a goodlite chart? is it something that hangs on the wall or is it a projector type thing? If it's something cheap that i can buy i'll get one just for piece of mind. I guess if i can read it at 30 feet instead of 20 feet in a room with the lights off then i might pass at NOMI. thanks for any info.

-jim
 

hopkins

Registered User
Virtu. Great info. Could you provide the same run down for the Depth Perception standards at NOMI. Thanks.
 

La Tech Aviator

Registered User
Can anyone help me?

I failed the depth perception test at MEPS, the passed another a few days later. I do not know if I was lucky, or just got the circles right.

I am due to go to OCS in June as a SNA, so I have a few questions.

1) I heard that the depth perception test was easier at Pensacola, is this true?

2) When will I get to do a physical and eye exam for a SNA, before or during OCS or API?

3) Is it ok to go to a civilian eye doctor, or will this put a red mark on my records?

Any help is appreciated!
 

virtu050

P-8 Bubba
pilot
from what I hear the depth perception test at OCS is harder than the one at MEPS. You will get your vision (and everything else) tested at NAMI on the second day of OCS. They are real strict with their standards. You may want to check back at previous posts about depth perception screening at NAMI. Good Luck!
 

La Tech Aviator

Registered User
virtu,

Thanks for the intel. Just a few more questions if you don't mind.

Is there any type of surgery or non surgery things I can do? Would it be OK, or advisiable to see an eye doc. before I go?

Thanks again for your wisdom.
 

virtu050

P-8 Bubba
pilot
The only kind of eye surgery the Navy will accept (as far as I know) is PRK laser surgery-Not LASIK! Also, you should do this before applying to OCS as you have to obtain a waiver (usually 3 months after the procedure) and you are instantlly disqualified should you get it. If you are disqualified then your slot is no longer secure and you need to reapply (this is what my recruiter told me). and the wait list seems to be rather long these days for OCS. Some people recommend doing eye exercises, avoiding near-work and eating carrots :) Good luck!
 

virtu050

P-8 Bubba
pilot
for depth perception, some people recommend getting those Magic Eye books where things pop out... dunno if it works.
 

La Tech Aviator

Registered User
Thanks for the advice.

I was accepted for OCS as a SNA, slated for a June 14th class date. It looks like I may need two more classes in order to graduate, so I will graduate in July or August in stead of May. Any idea of how long it will take me to get a new class date?

Thaks again!
 

BYSun

Registered User
Well. Have you ever seen bugs bunny in glasses??

The beta-cartoene in carrots is, I believe, a component of certain optic organs or tissues (rhodopsin, rods and cones, or some such) and the idea is if you have more of this in your system then you eyes can develop, maintain, or repair properly. I have never seen any studies to evidence improved eye sight for eating carrots in adults. Couldn't hurt, but then again, I'm just a dumb ol' anthropology student. ~_^

Have fun,

Bryce

In the end it all comes down to a simple choice, get busy livin' or get busy dyin' - The Shawshank Redemption
 

Ironnads

Registered User
Depth perception is a result of both eyes working together with your brain. If vision in one eye is worse than the other, then you are more likely to have a depth perception problem. If both eyes are 20/20, then I don't believe that PRK would do any good. The depth perception test at Pcola is actually easier. At mepps you have to pass the ancient Verhoff test (where you look in the box). At Pcola you are given this test first, but if you fail you will be able to take another test where you put on glasses and look at a book that the doctor holds up. This test was much easier for me. Also, someone mentioned earlier that looking at "magic-eye" pictures would help. My eye doctor recommended this and if you search the internet for "stereo vision" you will find many sites that say the same thing. Practicing on these images will help your brain and eyes work together. Another thing to consider is to take as much time as you need. When I look at "magic eye" images, the 3-d image doesn't immediately pop out. The depth perception test is the same way. Just look past the circles and wait a few moments. One of the circles should eventually stand out.
 

ghost_ttu

Registered User
I can never see those damn stereo images. I can do the glasses test though.

Eliminate distractions, focus on your goals and visualize what you hope to accomplish.
 
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