Platform Selection Changes

[David Peters]

Good afternoon. I am an SNFO looking for clarification regarding something I am hearing in API. I've heard from SNFOs currently in Primary that 1) Primary is way backed up right now, and 2) the first platform selection is no longer being done for SNFOs at the end of Primary - everyone is going through Primary 2 and then platform selection is being done at the end of Primary 2 including the E2 split.

I've heard this from several Studs but nothing official. Can anyone shine any light on this? I don't see the change in platform selection timing in of the materials I have. Thank you in advance.

 

[Aquonox]

I don't have any official documents either. I am currently in VT-10 and one of the classes ahead of me is in Visual Navigation right now of Primary 1. Their class is supposed to go through Primary 2 because VT-10/VT-4 doesn't have the Multi-Crew Simulators ready to go yet for the P-3/EP-3/P-8/E-6 guys.

Not sure how long this will last for and I am also not sure when the new VMTS syllabus for NFO jet selectees will be up and running either (I've heard around mid-October time frame. This is just speculation and rumor though so take it with a grain of salt).

The reason none of this is documented is because it was never supposed to happen. Since the new simulators have not been completed on time, NFOs going through Primary 2 is Plan B for now.

You are in API though, so I'm pretty sure you should be fine by the time you get here. The first few UMFO classes will be the guinea pigs for the new program, so hopefully things will get sorted out soon.

If anyone else has any better info, let me know. I've asked plenty of instructors (simulators and pilots) and have gotten many different answers. Also, if I have provided wrong information, please let me know.

 

[cfam]

Primary 2? Is that what they're calling the former intermediate syllabus these days?

 

[KilroyUSN]

So is the wishlist (once UMFO is fully functional) supposed to look like "Choose between E2, P-3, EP-3, E-6, VMTS" and then another wishlist at the end of VMTS between the Strike and Strike/Fighter or "Choose between E2, P-3, EP-3, E-6, EA-18G, F/A-18" after Primary?

How does Primary 2 differ from Primary 1?

 

[OscarMyers]

UMFO ppt Slide 17 should explain quite a bit about the pipeline flow.

 

[Aquonox]

After Primary 1, we are supposed to select between Maritime (E-6B, P-3C/P-8A. EP-3E) and Carrier Aviation. The Maritime guys go on to do what is called Advanced Maritime Command and Control simulators (aka Multi-crew simulators) and then go to their respective FRS.

During Primary 2 we fly a couple of instrument simulators/flights and form flights/simulators. After we finish, we are supposed to select between E-2Cs and Jets.

The E-2C guys go and do their Advanced Maritime Command and Control simulators before going to VAW-120.

The Jet guys go on to do Intermediate and Advanced (new VMTS syllabus).

 

[David Peters]

^^^^
Yeah, this is the issue. Now I guess there is no selection until after Primary 2.

 

[Aquonox]

Correct. At least until they get the Multi-crew Sims up and running. (whenever that will be)

 

[zippy]

More flight time/ training for the UMFOs the better. Having gotten to compare the Traditional Randolph trained guys with the gen 1 UMFOs showing up at the same time, the product the fleet got from the UMFO program was pretty worthless comparatively and the squadrons really had to shoulder the burdon of creating useful aircrew out of them, in addition to training them to be NavComms/TACCOs. We had some sharp dudes but the first 6-12 months were more rocky for them than the norm.

 

[CommodoreMid]

More flight time/ training for the UMFOs the better. Having gotten to compare the Traditional Randolph trained guys with the gen 1 UMFOs showing up at the same time, the product the fleet got from the UMFO program was pretty worthless comparatively and the squadrons really had to shoulder the burdon of creating useful aircrew out of them, in addition to training them to be NavComms/TACCOs. We had some sharp dudes but the first 6-12 months were more rocky for them than the norm.

+1. I was pretty much only useful for loading crypto and taking fixes when I checked into my squadron. I will say I'm impressed with the guys coming out of the P-8 side now. They actually train them to be tactically relevant. When I went through ARP a couple months ago I got a brand new check in who had been in the squadron all of two weeks as my COTAC and I was not excited at the prospect of having to do the job of two people through the experience, but he did an outstanding job. Sure, there were times I had to completely shut him out of the scenarios because there was no way he would have had the background to understand what was going on, but overall I didn't have to worry about him being retarded and it was awesome. I just hope they've raised the expectations on the P-3 side.

 

[zippy]

^Its about time the VP community started striving for tactical competency from its aircrew instead of accepting mediocracy because of its view of its assets as a systems problem vice a weapons system.

 

[Tycho_Brohe]

When does filling out the dream sheet take place? I was under the impression you filled out your preference at the beginning of Primary fairly soon after classing up. I start on Monday, and I haven't really heard much about it yet.

Also curious if anyone has heard more about the tailhook pipeline split to jets and E2/C2.

EDIT: To clarify, and if it makes a difference, I'm asking about Pilot pipeline. I forgot this thread was about UMFO's.

 

[wlawr005]

You'll put in your choices close to the end of primary. Right now, guys are still selecting Tailhook out of VTs

 

[Tycho_Brohe]

You'll put in your choices close to the end of primary. Right now, guys are still selecting Tailhook out of VTs

Gotcha, thanks.

 

[Tycho_Brohe]

Thought I'd post an update on here if anyone else is curious. Classed up on Monday, and we were told during our briefs that:

A) we'd be the last class to fly the T-34, and
B) when we select, jets and E-2/C-2 will be separate pipelines.

So what'll happen is, if you select E-2/C-2, you'll stay in Corpus for Multi-Engine, and jet guys will go to K'ville or Meridian. That way, E-2/C-2 pilots don't have to go from Corpus to K'ville and back again.
Like wlawr005 said, the split isn't final yet, but they're putting the final touches on the syllabus changes to make it work.