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Officer to enlisted SEAL

WhitingTJ

New Member
Hello all!

This is my first time creating a thread on a site that I have followed for a while now. I've enjoyed everything I've read here.

I am calling upon the great powers of AW to answer an interesting place where my friend is currently.

The situation: He is an academy graduate who was picked up as an NFO. He got all the way to advanced and attrited. Frankly, I have my theories as to why he made it as far as he did and conveniently "failed" an important exam... Regardless of that outcome, he has been bent on becoming a SEAL for a long time now. His original plan was to get into an NFO community that would hopefully become "invalid" after the jets were retired (i.e. Prowlers). He had hoped that his rank at the time of his departure from the aviation community would still allow him to apply for SEALS, but it appears that is not the case. From what I understand, he is considered "IRR" at this time unless he enters into a new community (which, from what I understand, he was denied entry into Surface Warfare). Since he is an academy grad, he still "owes" the Navy some time.

He wants to do whatever he can, including surrender his butter bars and enlist, in order to have a better shot at going to BUD/S. I believe I have read that the enlisted recruiting mission as of right now includes SpecWar. ..

Anyone have any ideas here?

I am excited to see what people present.

Please, let me know if I can clarify any of the details. Thanks, AW.
 

Brett327

Well-Known Member
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
I suspect that attriting from any program is going to make it extremely difficult to be accepted into ANY competitive program. If the SWOs won't take him, I doubt the SEALs will. The Navy can afford to be very picky these days. I'm going to say his chances are slim to none. As an aviator, anyone who takes a "tactical" down to attrite from a program is a douche bag and I don't want him in my cockpit. This guy should stay IRR and stay out of the way of the real professionals.

Brett
 

Stearmann4

I'm here for the Jeeehawd!
None
Hmmm, my first question is why did your friend accept orders as an NFO in the first place if he really wanted to be a SEAL? Regardless of his real motivation or potential as a SEAL officer, I can tell you with some certainty his sought after future as a SEAL enlisted or commisioned will be scrutinized because for whatever reason because he attrited an officer program. All the worse because there's probably a thousand guys who would cut off a limb to be an NFO these days.

If he was willing to "do anything" to go to BUD/S, he would've adequately prepared while at Annapolis, attended mini-BUD/S during the summer, etc to be a slam dunk for one of the highly selective annual BUD/S officer slots. It's no secret that academy grads have a better shot at BUD/S than ROTC and OCS, so if he didn't take full advantage...

It's certainly his option to resign his commision to undertake BUD/S as an E-5. Big gamble, as long as he's willing to understand up front that if he doesn't graduate, he'll have the very real possibility of floating on one of those disgusting gray things across the bay at 32nd street doing some straight up Sailor stuff wishing he was an NFO.

The Navy isn't really in the habit of rewarding poor performance, so my prediction based on historic observations; since your friend attrited I suspect he'll be haze gray for a couple of years and then be allowed to try to rush another career field..

MR-
 

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Brett is right, the Navy can be pretty picky right now, even SWOs, and the SEALs are just about as selective as they come in the military. So just about a snowball's chance for your buddy......

.....He wants to do whatever he can, including surrender his butter bars and enlist, in order to have a better shot at going to BUD/S. I believe I have read that the enlisted recruiting mission as of right now includes SpecWar....

That can get a bit tricky, once you are commissioned it is pretty hard and very uncommon to become enlisted (the exception in the Navy is LDOs but your friend ain't one so it is a moot point). I have known only of two folks who have done it, both USAF though, and it wasn't easy and they both had to get special waivers that were not hard to come by, one had to go all the way to SECAF. I don't know of Navy-specific rules/regs but I don't think it is a very viable option for your friend.

Edit: Stearmann apparently is smarter than me about Navy officer to enlisted, still a real long shot as he said though.
 

cfam

Well-Known Member
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
PM sent. I think we might have a mutual friend, and I know I've discussed this with him.
 

AirPirate

Active Member
pilot
All realistic comments. But on the flip side, the SEALs have some undeniably unique characters in their ranks who fought through a lot of adversity to get there. They are some of the most original people I have ever met with the stories to match. There are those among us who go through life writing their own tickets, and tell the rest of the world to get fucked. Guys who choose to pursue a life in special warfare usually fit that description for what it's worth. I just don't think there's a singularly elegant solution because every path to a goal like that starts out as unlikely as any other.
 

wlawr005

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
I suspect that attriting from any program is going to make it extremely difficult to be accepted into ANY competitive program. If the SWOs won't take him, I doubt the SEALs will. The Navy can afford to be very picky these days. I'm going to say his chances are slim to none. As an aviator, anyone who takes a "tactical" down to attrite from a program is a douche bag and I don't want him in my cockpit. This guy should stay IRR and stay out of the way of the real professionals.

Brett
I was wondering if I was the only one that was a little pissed off at this guy for pulling this shit. I know a lot of people who have worked very hard to be in the position he's in...I also know some people who have worked very hard and have been unable to get where he is.
 
A guy DOR'd from my ROTC unit as a senior because he wasn't selected for SEALs. As far as I know he went enlisted and is going through BUD/S. Definitely a different process than resigning a commission, but I can't blame the guy who's made it his mission to become a SEAL and won't accept anything else.
 

sickboy

Well-Known Member
pilot
A guy DOR'd from my ROTC unit as a senior because he wasn't selected for SEALs. As far as I know he went enlisted and is going through BUD/S. Definitely a different process than resigning a commission, but I can't blame the guy who's made it his mission to become a SEAL and won't accept anything else.

We've had at least three that I know of. One has survived BUD/S so far, and the one chipping paint on Boxer is going back next year.
 

Gatordev

Well-Known Member
pilot
Site Admin
Contributor
A guy DOR'd from my ROTC unit as a senior because he wasn't selected for SEALs. As far as I know he went enlisted and is going through BUD/S. Definitely a different process than resigning a commission, but I can't blame the guy who's made it his mission to become a SEAL and won't accept anything else.

This happens from time to time, but I wouldn't equate it to the same thing as taking a tactical down. Gator Alum James Suh did this and made it through to go on to big things. RIP.
 

BigRed389

Registered User
None
He should've gone SWO to begin with if he really wanted to go SEAL. It would've been the best way to get more than one shot to get picked to go to BUD/S. I personally know 2 guys that did it, and if you look at lateral transfer results, most of the guys going SPECWAR come from communities with short initial commitments, like SWO, CEC, or Supply.
 

WhitingTJ

New Member
This happens from time to time, but I wouldn't equate it to the same thing as taking a tactical down. Gator Alum James Suh did this and made it through to go on to big things. RIP.

Did you happen to read The Heart and the Fist? It mentions him specifically.
 

WhitingTJ

New Member
As an aviator, anyone who takes a "tactical" down to attrite from a program

What is a "tactical" down?

I am not entirely sure of what transpired with him, so, for the sake of the conversation, let's just assume that he was in Advanced for NFO, left, and is now in "purgatory."
 

WhitingTJ

New Member
All realistic comments. But on the flip side, the SEALs have some undeniably unique characters in their ranks who fought through a lot of adversity to get there. They are some of the most original people I have ever met with the stories to match. There are those among us who go through life writing their own tickets, and tell the rest of the world to get fucked. Guys who choose to pursue a life in special warfare usually fit that description for what it's worth. I just don't think there's a singularly elegant solution because every path to a goal like that starts out as unlikely as any other.

I agree with this.

I play post-collegiate club lacrosse here in Maryland. I ran into a guy at a game who plays for the USNA's club team. I asked him about his aspirations, and he mentioned that his first pick out of the Academy is BUD/S, but if he can't get that, he'll go Marine Recon, and if not that then... I don't recall his final choice.

Thank you all for your responses. Another question that can be posed: is there any reason why he shouldn't try an alternate route, such as Recon Marine (officer or enlisted) and try to move in from that angle?
 

WhitingTJ

New Member
He should've gone SWO to begin with if he really wanted to go SEAL. It would've been the best way to get more than one shot to get picked to go to BUD/S. I personally know 2 guys that did it, and if you look at lateral transfer results, most of the guys going SPECWAR come from communities with short initial commitments, like SWO, CEC, or Supply.

I agree. I think that he went for the aviation community with the mindset that it seemed exciting and that he didn't think he'd be able to make it into the SEAL community. However, since I've seen this kid, he has gone from chunky nerd to athlete. The guy has been working hard, and if there's a way to get where he wants to go, he will find it and take it--successfully.
 
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