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Jobs for NFO after term of service.

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
I know those that have moved up fast, they however moved to get that, but I know CI's and they have made no mention of availability pay, that may depend on the agency. I believe most top out at GS12 until they get into "in charge" jobs, so as a GS12 they would top out under 100K in most areas.

I believe the move up to GS-12 as a special agent-criminal investigator is a bit like getting to O-3 in the military for most agencies, pretty much automatic unless you screw up (here is the US Marshal promotion schedule for new agents). Availability pay is an federal government rule, if they are the right category of federal criminal investigators and law enforcement, they have been 'certified' and meet the work rules for it they rate it. Guess your buddies didn't work enough overtime!
 

exNavyOffRec

Well-Known Member
I believe the move up to GS-12 as a special agent-criminal investigator is a bit like getting to O-3 in the military for most agencies, pretty much automatic unless you screw up (here is the US Marshal promotion schedule for new agents). Availability pay is an federal government rule, if they are the right category of federal criminal investigators and law enforcement, they have been 'certified' and meet the work rules for it they rate it. Guess your buddies didn't work enough overtime!

I will ask but I bet you are right given the jobs they are currently in most are standard work hours for them, last I talked to one she was about to have a baby, she is an IRS CI, one other is NCIS, she is a GS12 and is prior USN enlisted, anytime a new assignment came up she would move for it, the other guy is NCIS and just last year moved to take a SAIC position and I lost track of him.

They all love their jobs.
 

Catmando

Keep your knots up.
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
One career at a time, grasshopper. One at a time. Long term plans and goals are fine. But those who overlook the real challenges at hand are ever more vulnerable for failure. Focus at what is in front of you right now, and in the immediate future, and not many years hence.

Pick what you want to be, and just do it! Don't waste your time and many others by taking up a slot, just as a stepping stone to be something in the future you will likely be changing your mind about anyway.
 

Mos

Well-Known Member
None
This thread may be getting a bit old, but I'll go ahead and post a question in here and avoid clogging the forum with new threads about job prospects: has anyone experienced or heard of any NFOs going into aerial firefighting? I've read a little about the air tactical group supervisors that fly for CALFIRE and other agencies during fire season. Sounds like generally those guys come from solid firefighting backgrounds, but I'm wondering if there are any exceptions, as some of the elements of their job sound similar to what P-3 and E-2 NFOs do.
 

Brett327

Well-Known Member
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
This has interested me as well, but haven't really looked into it much.
 

Brett327

Well-Known Member
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
I do know that a lot of the aviation in the Northwest is handled by contractors like Evergreen (and others) vice USFS or the state forestry guys. The USA jobs site has some interesting stuff from time to time, as do the contractor sites. I also know that some of the federal LE agencies like ICE/DHS operate aircraft and employ non-pilot flight crew members.
 

BleedGreen

Well-Known Member
pilot
I do know that a lot of the aviation in the Northwest is handled by contractors like Evergreen (and others) vice USFS or the state forestry guys. The USA jobs site has some interesting stuff from time to time, as do the contractor sites. I also know that some of the federal LE agencies like ICE/DHS operate aircraft and employ non-pilot flight crew members.
I know this thread is a little old but I thought I would share what I have learned about aerial firefighting.

When talking about the USFS, all but two of their helicopters and all their tankers are on a contract between a civilian company and the agency. For the light and medium helicopters, the crew will consist of a pilot, helicopter manager, and anywhere from 2-7 crew members. The crew members will deploy the bucket, direct water drops, and perform other fireline duties. The helicopter manager's duties are the most comparable to an NFO; which include communications, navigation, while serving as a liaison for the agency and contractor. A fire background required to be a manager because they too have to deploy with the crew and act as the supervisor while on the fireline. The large helicopters, skycranes, firehawks, k-maxx, etc will have a PIC and SIC flying while a manager stays with the ground crew.
As of 2012 the USFS has reduced the amount of tanker they have oncontract drastically. The most noticeable reduction in the tanker contracts was the decision to no longer renew any of the P3 contracts. The USFS still relies on the p-2v Neptunes but that is soon changing to turbine powered aircaft. I'm not 100% sure but I believe the P-2v's only have a PIC and possibly a SIC but no manager that flies with the aircraft. They also have a few oddball contracts from single engine air tankers all the way to the DC-10 (sorry no more 747's as tankers). Aside from tankers, the only other fixed wing aircraft the USFS relies on are twin engine commanders or king air's that fulfill the role of an air attack. They orbit the fire while orchestrating the aircraft and ground resources, which also requires an extensive fire background. The air attack is usually a GS 10-12 that worked his or her way up in the fire service.

Cal Fire does things a little differently but a fire background is still required for any crew or managerial roles. Their helicopters are all bell 205's (except San Diego has a 214) with a crew consisting of two helicopter manager and a handful of firefighters. They fly with two managers because one deploys with the crew and one flies with the pilot to communicate and navigate. Although a manager has to stay in the helicopter at all times, they must be able to fulfill both roles for staffing purposes.
As for Cal Fire's S-2's, they only require a pilot to fly, communicate, and drop retardant. They also fly the OV-10's as an air attack platform with a pilot and an air attack. The air attack is usually a retired USFS air attack with an extensive fire background or a former helicopter manager who came up through the ranks.
I hope this sums up any questions you may have had but if you have anymore to ask, feel free!!
 
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phrogdriver

More humble than you would understand
pilot
Super Moderator
I've seen many helo firefighting jobs posted, so I've been curious about it. They always require USFS cards and previous experience firefighting. Seems like a chicken/egg problem. How hard is it to get a card and break into that business?
 

Brett327

Well-Known Member
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
I wonder how the USFS requirements apply to the contract folks. I'm still ~10 years away from seriously pursuing post-Navy employment, but the fire fighting thing does still interest me.
 

BleedGreen

Well-Known Member
pilot
Their is a very detailed write up here that describes life a USFS helicopter pilot and the general requirements. The write up describes what its like to fly the medium or light airframes but doesn't go into much detail about flying the heavies or type 1 helicopters. Since type 1's are required to have two pilots at all times, those airframes are typically easier to get into as an SIC and work your way up.
That's speaking for the USFS but Cal Fire and local muncipalities are little different. I'm not too familiar with Cal Fire's hiring practices but I know certain municpalites such as LAFD and LA County Fire hire from within. SDFD, SD County Sheriff and OCFA will hire from the outside as well. The pilot for SD Sheriff used to post on here but I haven't seen anything recent from him in a year or more. I am sure he has more accurate info on Cal Fire/municipalities and what to expect. Cal Fire's San Diego unit borrows the county's 205's (not 214's my mistake) for fire and rescue which is where he flew.
Most of my time has been around the helicopter side of fire so I'm not familiar with what it takes to become a tanker pilot.
 
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