Highwater FITREP Burden

[BITS]

Hello Warriors - MH-60R bubba here,

I will try my best to keep this short -

Recently, I received the ultimate axe to the face during my first fleet tour highwater FITREP, #2 MP - timing was shitty and I was placed into a massive senior LT FITREP group with no possibility for extension. I was told by my COC this was due to "timing", several others are in the same boat with me. Currently I am slated for a major staff command shore tour. As expected, without an EP, all other attractive options were out of contention. Reading between the lines, it looks like my career is more or less on a downward spiral in terms of flying. I am looking for recommendations for a path forward to keep me on track. I know recent trends for O-4 selection have been looking better; however, is it still possible to pick up DH with this burden? If not, would other off the beaten path jobs look at me in the same negative light? Everything I read on this forum leads me to the same conclusion - without an EP during your shore tour, start looking at exit options if you still want to fly. It's sad that something this "random" and out of my control is now tainting my otherwise good record. I appreciate any tips or help!!

 

[squorch2]

Make your long range plans with a civilian exit at first opportunity.

That way if you are picked up for O-4/DH it’s a nice surprise, and you’re ready for a new life otherwise.

 

[squorch2]

(inside baseball: there is ALWAYS oppo for extension, just not for folks they rank MP.)

 

[squorch2]

Also also - your fate in the Navy is written, and no amount of extra work/effort (at current squadron or next jobs) will change that.

As such, take off the pack. Really.

 

[Jim123]

"It's not you, it's your timing, there's nothing I can do" is something managers say when they don't like your work but they won't man up and tell you straight to your face. Stand tall and politely thank everybody on your way out the door (and your wardroom farewell and at your checkout brief).

Maybe you suck at your ground jobs or maybe you're below average in the cockpit, or maybe you knocked it out of the park on command inspections/Battle E/flight quals. Regardless of any of that is true/not true/unfair perception, seek advice about your reputation from trusted DHs, and always do your best around the squadron (because your subordinates deserve nothing less).

You and your next command have a pretty steep uphill in terms of your fitreps, but regardless (again) of whether your naval career is salvageable, you're going to be asking that skipper to either endorse a transition board package or to be a job reference. You don't need to volunteer for every bad deal, just don't shoot yourself in the foot on your shore duty because of something that happened on your sea duty.

 

[Hair Warrior]

Not specific to the OP, but what would happen if someone in that situation incurred additional service commitment, for example: newly transferring their Post 9-11 GI bill benefits to a dependent? Would they still be separated from AD after 2x FOS for O4 and have to finish out the GI bill commitment as a SELRES? Would they be retained on AD as an O3 beyond 2x FOS until completing the GI bill commitment?

 

[Randy Daytona]

I agree with Squorch and Jim. If you still want a military retirement, you might want to start looking at the reserves / guard. A retirement paycheck is a nice thing to look forward to - and age 60 gets here faster than you can imagine.

 

[scoolbubba]

Also also - your fate in the Navy is written, and no amount of extra work/effort (at current squadron or next jobs) will change that.

As such, take off the pack. Really.

This is the second best piece of advice you've already gotten. The best was to prepare for your next life NOW. Not a year out from separation, now.

If you've got TA/GI Bill, get an advanced degree. Research skillbridge opportunities with companies that you'd like to work for. If there isn't one, reach out to their HR Department about starting one.

Don't worry about what the staff peeps think about you....the navy already decided what they're gonna do with you as soon as they can.

 

[Pags]

Former MP from 1st tour and subsequent 2xFOS for O-4 years later here. Not sure how O-4 selection rates will look in a few years and if anyone says they know they're wrong. For my situation I had multiple people say things like "you'll still make O-4 but DH will be hard, you'll be fine if your work hard at your next tours and break out there, take the hard jobs, etc." I probably would have been fine with my paper after my shore tour if O-4 selection rates hadn't totally bottomed out and surprised the entire USN.

Who knows if that will happen for you. So do good work and be a good guy over the next couple of years. Maybe it'll work out if O-4 rates are high. But don't bend over backwards and work yourself to death for something that is not a sure thing. Start coming up with a Plan B. Maybe that's lat xfer within USN, maybe it's FTS, maybe it's SELRES, maybe it's Guard, maybe it's civilian world.

Frankly you're off the golden path and there's not really a way back. Or, as someone else said to me years ago: USN doesn't have hospitals to get you well, they have leper colonies.

 

[taxi1]

If you still want a military retirement, you might want to start looking at the reserves / guard.

Second this.

I've seen it possible to "scoop it out" in the reserves, since the golden path is less well defined. On boards, and in time, the old fitreps get buried beneath (hopefully) a string of good ones.

But back in the day there were also some horrific promotion rates, so you take your chances.

 

[SlickAg]

Not specific to the OP, but what would happen if someone in that situation incurred additional service commitment, for example: newly transferring their Post 9-11 GI bill benefits to a dependent? Would they still be separated from AD after 2x FOS for O4 and have to finish out the GI bill commitment as a SELRES? Would they be retained on AD as an O3 beyond 2x FOS until completing the GI bill commitment?

If you’re involuntarily separated you don’t owe any additional time, no requirement to go SELRES.

Of note, if you do eventually get a reserve retirement, you have to pay back your invol sep pay by not getting your reserve retirement checks until the debt is gone.

 

[nittany03]

Second this.

I've seen it possible to "scoop it out" in the reserves, since the golden path is less well defined. On boards, and in time, the old fitreps get buried beneath (hopefully) a string of good ones.

But back in the day there were also some horrific promotion rates, so you take your chances.

Still possible. 2xFOS on active duty, just over one year as a SELRES O-5, currently trying to decide whether to buck for O-6 but keeping my options open.

It’s also the fact that almost everyone who joins the reserves is going to have “meh” paper before they get out, because whether you FOS or quit, no CO is going to waste an EP on you after that point, and the boards all know that.

Either way, like @taxi1 said, if you’re a goober it’ll show up on your SELRES FITREPS also. I didn’t get a high water EP on active duty because of possibly the most screwed-up timing ever. But due to putting in the work on my side, and some timing luck in the other direction, I showed up to my O-5 board with every single SELRES FITREP being EP.

I’d love to have been a fly on the wall in the tank to see the board’s reaction to my completely nonstandard PSR.

 

[Pags]

Second this.

I've seen it possible to "scoop it out" in the reserves, since the golden path is less well defined. On boards, and in time, the old fitreps get buried beneath (hopefully) a string of good ones.

But back in the day there were also some horrific promotion rates, so you take your chances.

Yeah, after I got 2XFOS I had to do three years in the reserves to get my severance. I made O-4 on my first look. But i didn't stick with the reserves because that gave me three things on my life plate and I had to pick two to excel at and I picked family and civilian career.

 

[Pags]

If you’re involuntarily separated you don’t owe any additional time, no requirement to go SELRES.

Of note, if you do eventually get a reserve retirement, you have to pay back your invol sep pay by not getting your reserve retirement checks until the debt is gone.

I didn't have to go IRR/SELRES for GI Bill. I technically owed a few months still on my last change to the Post 9-11 but the VA said because I was 2xFOS I would still keep those benefits. As I mentioned in the previous post I did have to 3yrs in the IRR to get the separation pay.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

If you’re involuntarily separated you don’t owe any additional time, no requirement to go SELRES.

Of note, if you do eventually get a reserve retirement, you have to pay back your invol sep pay by not getting your reserve retirement checks until the debt is gone.

I was wondering about this as well, we had a SWO-N LCDR who at about 8 years in was picked up for a degree program and would then owe the USN around 8 years, her fitrep after she submitted for the program was an MP so we were thinking that would be bad for her future in the USN, and the fact they had to split up her job because she wasn't able to handle it, the crying in the department office was an issue as well.