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GI Bill & Flight training

_andrew

New Member
I tried to apply to OCC to be a pilot. Long story short it didn't work out this time. Now I am applying for a ground contract. I would like to use the GI bill to try to work my way towards becoming a commercial airline pilot. A staff Sgt in my office told me I can tap into my GI bill after 3 yrs of service, but he recommended that I wait until I get out to start using it.

1. Could I start tapping into it to try and get my certifications and ratings while still being in the marines after year 3?

2. Would it be better to apply to a flight school after I leave the military?

If anyone has any experience with the GI bill and flight training to share it would be greatly appreciated
 

exNavyOffRec

Well-Known Member
I tried to apply to OCC to be a pilot. Long story short it didn't work out this time. Now I am applying for a ground contract. I would like to use the GI bill to try to work my way towards becoming a commercial airline pilot. A staff Sgt in my office told me I can tap into my GI bill after 3 yrs of service, but he recommended that I wait until I get out to start using it.

1. Could I start tapping into it to try and get my certifications and ratings while still being in the marines after year 3?

2. Would it be better to apply to a flight school after I leave the military?

If anyone has any experience with the GI bill and flight training to share it would be greatly appreciated

If you want to fly why not try the other services, USA, USN, or USAF?
 

jtmedli

Well-Known Member
pilot
Agree with the above. If your goal is to be an aviator, don't rule out applying with the USN (or USA, USAF for that matter). The application package is very similar so most of the work you've already done with the USMC OSO will transfer right over.

On the other hand, if you are dying to be a Marine Officer, and aviator second, then proceed with said plan. From what you described, it seems as if it's the other way around.
 

Sapper!

Excuse the BS...
Ok the big catch about the GI Bill and active duty is that it is paid a significantly lower rate than while separated from the service. Since the amount GI Bill you receive is pro rated by the day (yes 36 months total but it is by the day ultimately) you lose time. For example, I used a little GI Bill for one semester and fully expected my monthly stipend to be 1600 or so dollars when in fact it was only about 325. This was due to the fact that I was on active duty. As soon as I ETS'd it went to the full pay rate I was entitled to but I still lost about 110 days of my total eligible time.

Lastly, the flight training rules have changed over the years. At some point you could only use it to pay for 40-60% or something like that (this was the old GI Bill, chapter 30). Now you can use Post 9/11 GI Bill to pay for much more, but it has to be a part 141 style school only or tied to a degree seeking program. In addition to being a part 141 type school, the post 9/11 GI Bill cannot be applied to obtaining a PPL. However, that last part may have changed.

I actually process GI Bill benefits for veterans (and I am also a veteran) at my current job and have been there for about 2 and half years. That being said, pick up the phone right away and call 1-888-GIBILL1 and ask this question or hit their website, all that info is on there. Airwarriors may be able to chime in if they have used it but the rules change often.

If you need any help with finding this info out call me and I'll help. (337) 275-zero7two8, my name is Cullen

This post is grammatically all jacked up on mountain dew, don't flame me too bad.
 

_andrew

New Member
Agree with the above. If your goal is to be an aviator, don't rule out applying with the USN (or USA, USAF for that matter). The application package is very similar so most of the work you've already done with the USMC OSO will transfer right over.

On the other hand, if you are dying to be a Marine Officer, and aviator second, then proceed with said plan. From what you described, it seems as if it's the other way around.
I would love to but, the actual reason they wont take me as a marine pilot is a disqualification. I passed the astb, and all the medical. But I was given a test by a naval doctor for people who have had head injuries or have had a medication in the past. I did well on all of the tests except for a multi-tasking portion of the test where you are played a very fast recording of a list of numbers and you have to add up two numbers in you head and then add that sum to the third number said on the recording and say the answer out loud while the new numbers keep playing. Anyways i got lost after my third answer and screwed it up. Beating my self up for not practicing my simple addition tables as a kid.
Anyways my OSO told me NAMI would not like my test results and he told me to be a ground officer. I figured this disqualification would make air force and navy cringe at my application when they ask about previous dq's from other services.
My OSO basically said your best bet to fly with the military would be to go ground and get to know commanding officers really well and get some good recommendations and apply again. But he also said don't hold your breath.
 

Brett327

Well-Known Member
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
My OSO basically said your best bet to fly with the military would be to go ground and get to know commanding officers really well and get some good recommendations and apply again. But he also said don't hold your breath.

This makes zero sense, as no amount of CO recommendations are going to trump being medically DQ.
 

jtmedli

Well-Known Member
pilot
My OSO basically said your best bet to fly with the military would be to go ground and get to know commanding officers really well and get some good recommendations and apply again. But he also said don't hold your breath.

Your OSO is trying to lock you into a contract and generate numbers. No offense as that's his job. If I were you, I'd try to fight that medical DQ a little harder. That sounds like a ridiculous/bogus test. They tried to DQ me for my eyes multiple times and I fought it and got through. Just keep pushing. The USAF will do another (and likely totally different test) if you apply with them. I'd try that also. If you want to be a pilot, don't get too wrapped around the axle with the Marine OSO. I had literally the exact same thing happen: I was DQ'd for my eyes, pilot slots went away in the USMC, I went and applied with the USN (and was re-examined), and was accepted. Keep plugging away and don't take things lying down.
 

Renegade One

Well-Known Member
None
I would like to use the GI bill to try to work my way towards becoming a commercial airline pilot.
Can't speak to most of your concerns, but I do not believe GI Bill would ever cover getting your PPL…that's considered a "recreational qual". Beyond that, I've been told that if you can qualify for a Class II Medical and COMMIT to Instruments and then Commercial quals/ATP, etc., GI Bill can cover (depending on your personal eligibility). Admittedly, my info is dated.
 

Sapper!

Excuse the BS...
Can't speak to most of your concerns, but I do not believe GI Bill would ever cover getting your PPL…that's considered a "recreational qual". Beyond that, I've been told that if you can qualify for a Class II Medical and COMMIT to Instruments and then Commercial quals/ATP, etc., GI Bill can cover (depending on your personal eligibility). Admittedly, my info is dated.
This is my understanding at the moment as well with the exception of a bachelor degree tied to an aviation program at a 4 year university. A student cannot pay for the PPL with their GI Bill at a part 141 school.
 

jtmedli

Well-Known Member
pilot
Can't speak to most of your concerns, but I do not believe GI Bill would ever cover getting your PPL…that's considered a "recreational qual". Beyond that, I've been told that if you can qualify for a Class II Medical and COMMIT to Instruments and then Commercial quals/ATP, etc., GI Bill can cover (depending on your personal eligibility). Admittedly, my info is dated.

That seems almost like an argument in semantics. Couldn't the flight school just label it a "commercial license" program in order to allow the funding from the GI Bill?
 

Sapper!

Excuse the BS...
That seems almost like an argument in semantics. Couldn't the flight school just label it a "commercial license" program in order to allow the funding from the GI Bill?

Has to do with the reporting process for the VA. So for a "flight" student attending a part 141, you submit the enrollment period and have to select a "rating" that you are working towards. PPL is not included, the reality is that the "certifying official" (a so called VA trained designated person within the organization that is doing the reporting, conflict of interest) has a lot of room to screw that up as the VA regulations on what is allowed and what isn't are all there just very hard to dig out of the available information. So while you can call it a commercial license program, you can not actually report it as such. The VA makes up for this by doing a lot of auditing of paperwork and proof of student progress. They pick it apart to see if you checked for certain things and were documenting it accordingly. Yes is as cumbersome and painful as you can imagine (VERY hard for a traditional school, the "non-flight" students, as there are 10 different GI Bill programs).

Now, back to the traditional 4 year "non-flight" training, if it is a degree seeking program that includes commercial or whatever ratings, it will pay for the PPL rating as it is part of "tuition and fees".

So guess what I am trying to say is:
1) report training as a "commercial program"
2) regs say "no PPL"
3)VA checks student records and all things pertaining to the student (transcripts, hours, grades, progression, that you didn't bill for classes/hours that do not apply or that are explicitly not covered)
4) If the school in fact did that, they freeze all of your federal accounts and any GI BIll money.

BTW this actually happened. Basically, an idiot was running the reporting at our school but never came to work. The office languished for a few months. A real director came on board and did some amazing things and really got into understanding the VA and going out of her way to get the available training and resources (that the school had no idea were available, much less important). Well she worked for a year to resolve some serious financial errors from the previous idiot overbilling resulting in the students walking away with pockets of cash. She actually had paid the money back from the school's accounts and the VA made an error. Without any prior notice they shut down/froze every single account dealing with financial aid/operations/pell grants/student loans etc. They don't screw around.

You can only imagine what it was like when the president of the university shows up asking me about these payments!
 

_andrew

New Member
This makes zero sense, as no amount of CO recommendations are going to trump being medically DQ.
Then again I'm not sure it was actually an automatic dq but rather a test result that would make my packet less appealing than competitors. I'm really not sure but maybe this is what he is thinking
 
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