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Enlisted first then officer, what are the odds?

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GVSURob

Registered User
Hey guys / girls,

I've read many posts on this site, and decided to post my own question. I hope it hasn't been asked already, but here goes:

I'm graduating this april from a 4 year university with a 2.8 gpa. I know it's not good enough to get selected for aviator or flight officer, but I was wondering if I were to go enlisted for the minimum enlistment (4 yrs I think), doing something like working on planes or something like that, and then applying for officer if the chances are better for someone coming from the enlisted side of the house? It seems like that would give you some kind of a boost, but friends of mine in the service seem to think otherwise. Just wondering if anyone knows something about the subject. Thanks, and congrats to all of you selected this time around.

Rob M.
Grand Rapids, MI
 

slvinst8

Registered User
Go see an officer recruiter. You may be able to get into the BDCP program! I am sure that the recruiter can give you some sort of an idea of where you can go with it. DO NOT go enlisted with a degree. My husband was also prior enlisted, and thankfully got into BDCP! Good luck.
 

JDSINGLE

Registered User
If you are graduating with a bachelor's you can go PLC as soon as you graduate. Good advice on that earlier post. Go see a recruiter. See what he can offer you. You never know, he might let you take th ASTB, and if you pass it, Look out Pensacola. Good luck
 

jaguar1

Registered User
I'm in the same boat as you are, Rob. If you've got a good PFT score and some smoking recommendations, look into the Marines- those can heavily compensate for an average GPA.

cheers!
mwp
grand forks, nd
 

GVSURob

Registered User
Cool,
thanks everyone you've all been very helpful. I'll give the marine recriter a call on monday, it doesn't matter to me what branch I'm flying in (although I'd prefer the Navy) as long as I'm flying! (Those marine dress blues look damn cool too!) Cya.

Rob
 

Crowbar

New Member
None
Originally posted by GVSURob
I'll give the marine recriter a call on monday, it doesn't matter to me what branch I'm flying in (although I'd prefer the Navy) as long as I'm flying! (Those marine dress blues look damn cool too!)

Anybody on this board will tell you that is exactly opposite from the attitude you should have about being a Marine. You join the Marine Corps to be a Marine and if you're a pilot, great. You don't join to be a pilot and play Marine on the side. And you certainly don't join because the uniform looks cool. Look around in the Marine section, this has been beaten into the ground pretty good but still people come up with statements like this.
 

Vandy7

F-14B/D RIO
College Degree...wants to be an officer...bad/average GPA...enlist?

Funny you should mention that...

First, the disclaimer: Everyone else is right...by all means, if there is any program you can go into NOW, even if it is not the service you would prefer, then that is probably the path the smart money is on. And the guys who say you join to be an officer first and flyboy second are 100% correct. Can't stand the guys I work with who are officers in name only. American, Naval Officer, Aviator, NFO, RIO, Squadron member, in that order.

Now, having said that: 2.X GPA from Ga Tech in a ME degree. 1994. Drawdown. Sent away for OCS info (had to put GPA on postcard) Got back a letter with the address of the local enlisted recruiter. Took the hint, and since I REALLY wanted to be an officer, I enlisted. Really had a love affair with subs, so I became a Sonar Tech subs.

Now the big question. Is the 2.8 the result of you maxing out your innate capabilities, or because you didn't try your hardest? If the first, no prob, but just be aware that life is a tough business, and the competition can be brutal. If the second, then its time to buckle down if you have any intention to suceed in any branch. If I studied as hard in college as I did in flight school I'd probably invented the cure for cancer.
You see, I was a slacker. But in the Navy I caught fire. Top student in RTC, first in Sub School, first in A School, came in as an E-3, made E-4 after eight months (perfect score on the test). Qualified in subs in five months (you have twelve--I set the record for my boat). Made LPO of Deck Div after a year and three months. Picked up for OCS after a year and eight months. Total enlisted time: two years, two months (not counting OCS).
I say the above not to beat my chest and try to impress anybody (we all think we are future CNOs anyway), but to drive home a point--if you go enlisted, you are going to be looked upon as a really smart enlisted guy, and not a future officer candidate just slumming. The Navy is the worst service for going from enlisted to officer, IMO. Once you enlist, they have you, and they view you as exactly what you are--a bluejacket. Met several guys on the same program I was on, but since they were drifters in college and were still drifting in the Navy when I met them, I can only assume that they are either still enlisted or never made it and got out. So, you break out of that by proving that you are officer material. And part of that is by not just doing well as an enlisted guy, but excelling, by doing very very very well.. In other words, the only one who will hold you to the standards you need to achieve will be yourself. Your supervisor won't do it--you are already far exceeding what he needs out of you.
If you don't, you are still not sunk, it will just take more time--4,5,6 years. Better to come out of the corner swinging.

Regardless, throughout the entire process of biding your time, there are some rocks and shoals to avoid. First, you will be smarter and older (and hopefully more mature) than your buds of equivalent rank. This can turn into a problem if you are not aware of it. Second, not every supervisor is going to be exactly thrilled to get a college dude who comes in off the bat saying "Golly Gee, I'm going to be an officer", while at the same time the you really are just beginning to do the job the Navy is actually paying you for--a job that he already knows backwards and forwards. So, you WILL need people skills. Not even a really big challenge, but just be aware the problem might be there.
Also, while your natural peers (by dint of education and age) will be the JO's, maintain friendly but military distant and correct relations. That will show you are true blue Navy, and avoid the ire of senior enlisted.
On the plus side, commands LOVE guys that can possible get OCS slots, as everyone gets to put stuff like that on their FITREPS, etc., showing what great mentors and leaders they are. Guys like Department Heads and XO's will be your natural allies. The JO's will be supportive, but are busy with their own careers. Senior enlisted outlook will depend upon their personal character. If the guy is a man and leader, he will usually help any other man rise to his natural ability. If not, just remember he really can't stop you if you have what it takes.
Also, you are there to do the enlisted job, not on some work study program for wayward youths. Be danged good at your job. Pick one you will have a passion for. If things don't work out, its going to blow doing something for four years that you don't enjoy. Go subs or aviation, and avoid the surface community. Both subs and aviation have both smaller commands (easier for LCDRs to notice you) and have smarter enlisted guys (easier for you not to go crazy).
Know the instruction for the program you want cold. Don't expect anybody else to do your paperwork for you. Part of being an officer is taking charge and seizing the intiative.

Anyway, that's it. Free advice, and probably worth what you paid for it. The pitfalls don't end there. Once you get a commission, you will be older than your peers, again, and also more experienced with the military. Which, in your peers eyes, will count for jack AND squat. On your nugget cruise, you will be exactly that--a dumb nugget. Doesn't matter if you could build the plane because you just spent two years working on it. Starting out on the rookie level again and again can get discouraging. But these are not showstopping obstacles, just speed bumps to be aware of.

Good Luck.
 

digger

There is a speed limit when taxing officer?
Awesome advice! You should make a sticky of this. Everyone who is thinking of enlisting to become an officer must read.
 

GVSURob

Registered User
WOW! Thanks to vandy7, you insight is priceless, and I thank you for the time and effort you put into your response, it's people like you that make this webite a valuable source of knowledge and worhtwhile.

To crowbar: what's your problem? I said one little thing and you jumped down my throat for it. (?) We're all supposed to be friends here. If you're looking to debate with, or make fun of somebody go to a chat room on AOL... although you might think I'm an idiot, and I did make an ignorant comment when I said "the marine dress blues look damn cool too" it's not your job as a visitor of this website to judge, rate or convict someone for making statements, the navy will decide what kind of person I am when they review my package.
 

Crowbar

New Member
None
Nobody jumped down your throat. Reread my post and think of it as helpful advice, because that's what it is. Anyways, I stand by what I said, I think you just took it wrong.
 

USMCBebop

SergeantLieutenant
JDSINGLE said:
If you are graduating with a bachelor's you can go PLC as soon as you graduate. Good advice on that earlier post. Go see a recruiter. See what he can offer you. You never know, he might let you take th ASTB, and if you pass it, Look out Pensacola. Good luck
Negative! For seniors and college grads, the USMC commisioning program he would be applying for is OCC - Officer Candidates' Class. Same requirements as PLC, only it's more competitive to get into.
 
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