Clarification on listing SNA and NFO on application

[aribjc]

Hello all,

I've seen Rufio mention this a couple times, saying that you should not list NFO unless youre willing to be one. I'm willing to do so, and thats not really my question, I just wanted to preemt the people telling me to search the forums for this answer. Based on what I've read on this website, I've gathered that even if I'm competitive and selectable for SNA, if I put NFO as my 2nd choice, there is a chance I will get NFO instead of pilot. However, when I spoke to my recruiter this past weekend (who has done a LOT to get me to this point, so I trust him very much), he said that the only way I would get NFO instead of pilot is if I were not selected pilot but I was picked up for NFO. Basically he was saying that there is no point not listing NFO as a choice because it would have no effect on whether I got SNA or not. He said that the board would review my application for SNA, and if I didn't get selected for that, only then would I be evaluated for NFO. So my question is, am I understanding him correctly, and is he understanding the new procedures correctly?

Thanks!

 

[HAL Pilot]

He’s a recruiter. You believe him?

 

[aribjc]

He’s a recruiter. You believe him?

He's stuck with me even after I got a hard no from the navy and was able to help me turn it into a yes. His time definitely could've been spent more efficiently on someone else so yes I believe him, but since it's a new way of doing things I want to make sure there's no misunderstandings.

 

[HAL Pilot]

Wanna buy a bridge? Cheap?

He has a quota to fill. He doesn't care if it is pilot or NFO. If you apply for both but you really want to be a pilot and get accepted for NFO and rejected for pilot, you're going NFO or nothing. If you turn down NFO to reapply for pilot you'll never get accepted for any Navy officer program in the future no matter how good your re-application.

 

[Judge Q]

I'm just another loser applicant so take my advice for what it's worth but I feel fine applying SNA/NFO because NFO is still a helluva a lot better than what I would be doing otherwise, if you do both and don't get SNA but do get NFO you can ride shotgun in jets, if you only apply SNA and don't get it you're driving a Mazda to work at the cubicle farm or as assistant manager at the Crab Shack (or whatever you do now).

My 2¢

 

[Eggsy_93]

My $0.02 is that I don’t believe it’s an auto no for pilot if you put the two choices down. Your application will still go in front of the Pilot board. Each app is viewed differently. I understand it as basically you are guaranteed into the Navy if you put both. It mainly boils down to the needs of the Navy. They need co-pilots just as bad as pilots. You still go to API then to UPT, like pilots, and fly shot gun in whatever aircraft is given to you. In a few years you can reapply to the Pilot board. They pull from co-pilots applicants first to fill Pilot slots anyway. Plus airliners like it if you are a co-pilot first in your Navy career, because you run most of the operations anyway, all pilots do is fly. What everyone is talking about is basically don’t be a sour puss if you don’t get Pilot and offered Co-Pilot then turn it down because you didn’t want it and waste your chance of getting in. I’m applying both because I like both options and you still are a Navy Aviator and an Officer. Plus I’ve watched this forum for the last 3 boards and have seen people that apply to both boards and make it as pilots. And I’ve watched people with better pilot scores get co-pilot. It all comes down to the needs of the Navy. It’s a long job I interview without actually interviewing for it.

 

[aribjc]

I'm just another loser applicant so take my advice for what it's worth but I feel fine applying SNA/NFO because NFO is still a helluva a lot better than what I would be doing otherwise, if you do both and don't get SNA but do get NFO you can ride shotgun in jets, if you only apply SNA and don't get it you're driving a Mazda to work at the cubicle farm or as assistant manager at the Crab Shack (or whatever you do now).

My 2¢

This is exactly my mindset, I guess I'm just trying to figure out the process but it may be that just isnt something that you can know unless youre actually on the board.

 

[aribjc]

Wanna buy a bridge? Cheap?

He has a quota to fill. He doesn't care if it is pilot or NFO. If you apply for both but you really want to be a pilot and get accepted for NFO and rejected for pilot, you're going NFO or nothing. If you turn down NFO to reapply for pilot you'll never get accepted for any Navy officer program in the future no matter how good your re-application.

I appreciate the info. I would much rather be an NFO than nothing at all, I'm just curious about whether listing NFO would actually diminish my chances of getting SNA since i know that my NFO part of the ASTB is relatively high compared to the others. Thanks again for the responses

 

[Treetop Flyer]

My $0.02 is that I don’t believe it’s an auto no for pilot if you put the two choices down. Your application will still go in front of the Pilot board. Each app is viewed differently. I understand it as basically you are guaranteed into the Navy if you put both. It mainly boils down to the needs of the Navy. They need co-pilots just as bad as pilots. You still go to API then to UPT, like pilots, and fly shot gun in whatever aircraft is given to you. In a few years you can reapply to the Pilot board. They pull from co-pilots applicants first to fill Pilot slots anyway. Plus airliners like it if you are a co-pilot first in your Navy career, because you run most of the operations anyway, all pilots do is fly. What everyone is talking about is basically don’t be a sour puss if you don’t get Pilot and offered Co-Pilot then turn it down because you didn’t want it and waste your chance of getting in. I’m applying both because I like both options and you still are a Navy Aviator and an Officer. Plus I’ve watched this forum for the last 3 boards and have seen people that apply to both boards and make it as pilots. And I’ve watched people with better pilot scores get co-pilot. It all comes down to the needs of the Navy. It’s a long job I interview without actually interviewing for it.

NFO’s aren’t co-pilots.

UPT is an Air Force term, and NFO’s have a completely different training pipeline after API.

NFO’s don’t “run most of the operations” at least not for any aircraft where you’d be “riding shotgun” instead of riding in a tube.

Airliners don’t like anything, they are inanimate objects. The airlines definitely do not like NFO’s. You’d be in the same place as someone who started as a SWO or any other non-pilot job.

 

[Eggsy_93]

NFO’s aren’t co-pilots.

Where is your source? Most navy aircraft require two pilots.

UPT is an Air Force term, and NFO’s have a completely different training pipeline after API.

I know it is, I couldn’t think of the term for basic flight school before advanced jet or Helos.

NFO’s don’t “run most of the operations” at least not for any aircraft where you’d be “riding shotgun” instead of riding in a tube.

Airliners don’t like anything, they are inanimate objects. The airlines definitely do not like NFO’s. You’d be in the same place as someone who started as a SWO or any other non-pilot job.

If you start as a Co-Pilot then move to pilot later in your career is what I’m getting at. It shows that you have all around knowledge of the aircraft and flight operations.

 

[Treetop Flyer]

If you start as a Co-Pilot then move to pilot later in your career is what I’m getting at. It shows that you have all around knowledge of the aircraft and flight operations.

No. You don’t. An NFO isn’t a co-pilot. Period.

DO NOT apply for NFO if you want to be a pilot. There is zero guarantee of switching to pilot (4-5 years) down the road.

 

[Eggsy_93]

No. You don’t. An NFO isn’t a co-pilot. Period.

DO NOT apply for NFO if you want to be a pilot. There is zero guarantee of switching to pilot (4-5 years) down the road.

Who sits second seat on P-8s, Helos, and E-2s? Actual pilots and not flight officers?

 

[Judge Q]

Who sits second seat on P-8s, Helos, and E-2s? Actual pilots and not flight officers?

Yes. There are no NFOs in helos. 3 pilots in a P8/2 NFOs in the back (not copiloting). 2 pilots in E2s with 3 NFOs in the back in the tube.

No offense but even I knew that so it's pretty basic knowledge, if you've already started your application and are this convinced NFOs are copilots you might need to do a wee bit more research into what you're getting yourself into (and maybe don't fight people with wings).

 

[Eggsy_93]

Yes. There are no NFOs in helos. 3 pilots in a P8/2 NFOs in the back (not copiloting). 2 pilots in E2s with 3 NFOs in the back in the tube.

No offense but even I knew that so it's pretty basic knowledge, if you've already started your application and are this convinced NFOs are copilots you might need to do a wee bit more research into what you're getting yourself into (and maybe don't fight people with wings).

Better clarification. All my research pointed towards NFOs as co-pilots and the pipelines I found showed them going through API and Primary.

And this is what this forum is for anyway.

 

[Judge Q]

Better clarification. All my research pointed towards NFOs as co-pilots and the pipelines I found showed them going through API and Primary.

And this is what this forum is for anyway.

I wasn't trying to jump up your ass, I wish you the best of luck as a future copilot helicopter NFO