Civilian Flying: Job Security

[BFisher]

So my plan is to go to Embry Riddle Daytona on a NROTC Scholarship and major in Aeronautical Science. Thats if everything goes perfectly. Now, lets say I get myself a pilot slot and serve my time as a Navy pilot - Then I can sneak my way into the civilian airline community pretty easily making some decent money (From what I read)

But lets say I dont get a pilot slot.. and serve as a SWO

, or NFO

, then try to go Civilian Airlines (Since I will be commercially rated from AS anyway). I hear/read that I will end up being a CFI making 10k a year for a while.. then go to corporate flying and make less than 50k per year. A laid-off Delta pilot told me that he only made 50k a year and the only way to make six figures

is to be former military and slip right into the big-boy program.

Can anyone confirm this? Is it true that if I miss my chance for Navy flight school then im financially doomed when my service time is up or is this ex-delta pilot crazy? Its a huge risk...

... That I am going to take, and I know I will be fine whatever I do but I just want to know what im up against.

Thanks guys!

 

[ben]

All I have to say is don't join the Navy if you don't want to be a Naval Officer. Worry about the rest when you get there. Not trying to be an ass...

 

[BFisher]

Well I do want to be an officer and thats a given. It comes above flying. And lets say I decide not to go career and I do want to fly civilian.. then it might be a problem. As I said it wont affect me joining the navy.. being an officer is my dream and a career outlook wont change that.. but id be stupid to "not worry" about my future

 

[olpa9901]

who needs to make six figures...unless you want to be buying needless crap all the time. I know tons of corporate pilots that make less then 100k a year and they seem to have awfully comfortable lives.

 

[wink]

I was an NFO and now fly for AA. I flew with a guy last week that was a USMC Air Traffic Control Officer. You do end up playing catchup a couple years, but you would do fine. Don't know what the Delta guy ment. Pay is based soley on seniority and aircraft type flown. A couple years flying for a commuter or corporate after the Navy will not prevent a guy from being a top earner. I have to tell you though, the airline business is changing very quickly. Flying for the major airlines will probably always be financially rewarding, but nothing like years passed. The lifestyle is changing too. Don't focus on the money. If you become an NFO or SWO and keep current as a pilot, you will find a good job piloting planes after the Navy. Don't sweat it now!

 

[46Driver]

I agree with Wink - with the addition of saying that timing is literally everything. You also have to remember that you can go to what you think is a good airline, only to watch it go bankrupt and be out of a job (think PAN AM, Eastern, maybe United and USAir). The airline industry is changing rapidly and who knows where it will end up. Finally, that comment about 6 digit salaries being sufficient - a lot depends on where you live. In Pensacola you can live like a king on that money but New York or San Fran would be another story entirely.

 

[confused_pilot]

Another side note. I am currently in NROTC at Illinois doing aviation, and flew out in Annapolis at NAFC with Frank Kennedy,USMC Ret. He flew A4's and AV8a/b and now flies 747's, so I'm learning a thing or two aobut the business. Also he's a great guy to fly with if you are ever out near the academy. I have my time pretty well set, with alot of multi but most kids coming out of these college programs leave with 400 hours and only 20 multi if they are lucky. You will find out later in your career that being a commercial pilot, no matter if your get it at ERAU or anywhere else, means squat! I got my Commercial certificate with 225 hours, and the only thing I could do is jump around because to get paid flying you need 1500 or so hours, unless you want to be a lifetime instructor. So I would have to agree with Wink, if you get SWO or NFO, keep your licence current, and if you have your CFI use it. I know a LT JG who worked out a deal with an FBO, I forget where, where insted of being paid for instucting on the weekends, because I dont think we are allowed to have another job, they put money aside in an account which he can fly off. I dont know if that was "kosher" but nevertheless a good way to build time if it was.

 

[wink]

Don't think spending time as a NFO or even SWO is wasted if you want to be a pilot as a career. At the point where you would be getting a flying job out of the Navy you will be competing with civilian only apllicants that haven't hsd near the responsiblity, maturity, or general airmanship (for NFOs) that you would have. At the least it proves to be a tie breaker in the hiring process. During my airline interview all they wanted to talk about was flying in the Navy. They didn't care about my civilian time. It seemed just a formality.

 

[bunk22]

Originally posted by olpa9901
who needs to make six figures...unless you want to be buying needless crap all the time. I know tons of corporate pilots that make less then 100k a year and they seem to have awfully comfortable lives.

Why not strive for six or seven figures? Just because one makes 100K plus a year doesn't mean they buy needless crap. Money doesn't buy happiness but what if you're already happy? Money is the cherry on the icing in that case.

 

[BFisher]

Yeah I live in Taxachusetts =) I did not really give thought to living elsewhere though. Its a good point. Things are alot cheaper down south.

 

[Ryoukai]

^ But the downside to that, you'd have to be in the South...a horrible horrible place to be.

 

[phrogdriver]

Where are these airline pilots earning 100K+ a year? It takes a long time to get to that point in the airlines. It also takes a lot of luck, i.e. not getting laid off or having your airline go tango uniform on you. That's not to say it's not possible, just that flying for the airlines had better be something you'd like to do anyway, because you may be on the Ramen noodle meal plan for longer than you want. You'd better enjoy the travel and living out of a suitcase. There is no plan for sliding right out of the military and into a cush airline job, even if you are a heavy driver. And, if you fly anything other than a heavy multi in the military, you'd better have some serious civilian time to get hired.

I'm not knocking airline guys at all. It's just that I know lots of pilots who fly RJs and also are reservists, and for a lot of them, their reserve check is the bigger one each month. You've got to like to fly and like the lifestyle. If you want to be an airline driver, get your CFI and MEI and instruct at Mesa or AllATP or one of those. You'll get on the airline track faster than you would in the military. A lot of civilian IPs put my hours to shame.

And Bunk, if you're looking for SEVEN figures, I think you're on the wrong website. Not too many pilots are pulling that kind of money.

 

[bunk22]

Originally posted by phrogdriver

And Bunk, if you're looking for SEVEN figures, I think you're on the wrong website. Not too many pilots are pulling that kind of money.

I'm talking about life in general. Don't think for a moment though that if you invest wisely that your money can't turn into something big. I wish I spoke from experience but I'm trying (and far, far, far away from 7 figures). With my bonus and a few other investments though, I'm actually netting six figures this year. It will go down a bit for the next four years but I will still hit the six figure gross mark. The military and flying in general isn't a huge paycheck but a stable and continually increasing one. Do it right from the get go and it could pay off in the end.

You're right about the airline pilots, it takes a while to get the higher pay. I happen to know a few at the $150-160K range. They've been with their respective airline for right around 10-12 years so they've got some seniority. Definitely not what I'm looking for if I retire from the military. Too old to start from the bottom and move up.

 

[phrogdriver]

Wish I got that fat Navy bonus, and not that pittance of a Marine helo bonus we're offered. Oh, well, at least I get to wear a cool uniform...

 

[bunk22]

Originally posted by phrogdriver
Wish I got that fat Navy bonus, and not that pittance of a Marine helo bonus we're offered. Oh, well, at least I get to wear a cool uniform...

Being a Marine Aviator is and should be **** hot in anyone's book. Sempri Fi.