SWO description, career paths, and other basic questions

[Rickard]

The norm, which is what the SWO community managers, placement officers, and detailers will all push you towards is the traditional two division officer tours, shore duty, then two department head tours, then shore duty, and then finally XO/CO fleet up. All of this should occur on board a DDG or CG and make sure you get plenty of AEGIS time.

But not everybody wants that and many will depart this path for a tour or two. There are some new programs available like the Weapons & Tactics Instructor (WTI) program that is in its infancy right now. You would still follow the original golden path to command but you get to go to a bunch of schools and become a subject matter expert (SME) in a particular part of Naval Warfare, be it Anti-Submarine Warfare, Mine Warfare, or Air-Missile Defense. There is also the Specialty Career Path (SCP) program that is designed to billet officers from all communities into a certain "pipeline" so that we can have warfare-qualified professionals in areas like Anti-Terrorism, Acquisitions, Finance, and the like. These officers give up command but will get detailed differently to different staff billets worldwide.

Be advised that both the SCP and WTI programs are new, weird, and non-traditional, and therefore their future is iffy and those who have been selected into them may or may not have vibrant SWO careers ahead of them because they have departed from the golden path of command.

There are also some new initiatives where you can take a break in the middle of your career for a year or two, but this is all brand spankin' new (I literally got the brief from PERS-41 himself about 2 months ago) and the kinks are not worked out. Also, they don't change the trajectory of your career towards command. I guess what I'm saying is, you're only really going to be tactical as a division officer and maybe on your first shore tour. After that your job becomes mainly administrative with some watchstanding thrown into it.

If your dream is to stay on the tactical level your entire career, go enlisted. The job of an officer is to be groomed to eventually rise to the level of the strategic so he or she can make those high level decisions. That's what all career development programs across all communities are based upon.

How long do tours and shore duty usually last? And how many years is typical until you finish your first DH tour?

 

[azguy]

This is notional, but will be how the vast majority of SWOs spend their first 10 years in the Navy:

3.5-4 years for your first two DIVO tours (of which you can expect 1-3 deployments)
3-4 years on shore (your shore duty plus 8 months of DH training in RI and VA)
3 years for two DH tours (18 months each, though they have recently shortened to as little as 12 months each)

...That gets you to 10-11 years in the Navy, wearing LCDR, then you do 5-10 years of shore duty depending on how you do at the command board (hint: you're hoping for the 5 year option). To answer your second question, you will check out of your 1st DH tour about 9-10 years after commissioning.

 

[Rickard]

This is notional, but will be how the vast majority of SWOs spend their first 10 years in the Navy:

3.5-4 years for your first two DIVO tours (of which you can expect 1-3 deployments)
3-4 years on shore (your shore duty plus 8 months of DH training in RI and VA)
3 years for two DH tours (18 months each, though they have recently shortened to as little as 12 months each)

...That gets you to 10-11 years in the Navy, wearing LCDR, then you do 5-10 years of shore duty depending on how you do at the command board (hint: you're hoping for the 5 year option). To answer your second question, you will check out of your 1st DH tour about 9-10 years after commissioning.

At what point during all this could you try for one of the WTI or SCP programs?

 

[zippy]

This is notional, but will be how the vast majority of SWOs spend their first 10 years in the Navy:

3.5-4 years for your first two DIVO tours (of which you can expect 1-3 deployments)
3-4 years on shore (your shore duty plus 8 months of DH training in RI and VA)
3 years for two DH tours (18 months each, though they have recently shortened to as little as 12 months each)

...That gets you to 10-11 years in the Navy, wearing LCDR, then you do 5-10 years of shore duty depending on how you do at the command board (hint: you're hoping for the 5 year option). To answer your second question, you will check out of your 1st DH tour about 9-10 years after commissioning.

5-10 years or shore duty before back out to sea for command? No wonder the Navy gets a lot of Ship COs are barely competent when it comes to tactics and ship driving, but total admin champs.

 

[azguy]

At what point during all this could you try for one of the WTI or SCP programs?

WTI would be at yrs 2 or 4 depending on what program. SCP is after or during your DH tours. WTIs stay on track for command, whereas SCP is an "off-ramp" for command.

 

[azguy]

5-10 years or shore duty before back out to sea for command? No wonder the Navy gets a lot of Ship COs are barely competent when it comes to tactics and ship driving, but total admin champs.

5 yrs would be the max for command-at-sea; great for QOL, not great for readiness. You definitely raise a known issue, which was highlighted after the WPL/-60S accident. The party line is that during one of those shore tours, the command-screened guys work at what you would probably call a "production" tour to help keep them current, but my understanding is that goal often loses out to BUPERS' wider "needs of the Navy."

10 years of shore duty is the terminal guys that don't screen and get out; you can tell them because they are the extremely disgruntled SWO O-4/5 at any large staff you go to.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

10 years of shore duty is the terminal guys that don't screen and get out; you can tell them because they are the extremely disgruntled SWO O-4/5 at any large staff you go to.

would these guys also be CO's of random shore duties that don't require a command at sea first? If so that would explain some of my CO's on shore duty.

 

[azguy]

Like the rest of the URL, we have three eventualities when talking about command screening: command at sea; command ashore; no command.

That said, it seems like NRD CO is a pretty good consolation prize for not getting your own ship, I wouldn't be too disgruntled.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

Like the rest of the URL, we have three eventualities when talking about command screening: command at sea; command ashore; no command.

That said, it seems like NRD CO is a pretty good consolation prize for not getting your own ship, I wouldn't be too disgruntled.

Several of the ones I had seemed pretty disgruntled, but back then it was XO/CO fleet up, so these guys were XO then didn't get screened for CO, maybe that factored in on the attitude they had.

 

[AllAmerican75]

WTI would be at yrs 2 or 4 depending on what program. SCP is after or during your DH tours. WTIs stay on track for command, whereas SCP is an "off-ramp" for command.

Also, be advised that the WTI selection requires that you spend shore duty tours at the Navy Surface Warfare Development Command or whatever it's called now. This is so you can put your knowledge to use revising and devising tactics. Also, because of the vast amount of time and money now invested in you, you will be required to sign the SWO bonus. If you're against signing the bonus or on the fence, WTI may not be for you.

 

[azguy]

Also, be advised that the WTI selection requires that you spend shore duty tours at the Navy Surface Warfare Development Command or whatever it's called now. This is so you can put your knowledge to use revising and devising tactics.

There are different jobs in almost every FCA available to WTIs.

Also, because of the vast amount of time and money now invested in you, you will be required to sign the SWO bonus. If you're against signing the bonus or on the fence, WTI may not be for you.

Totally false. SWO bonus was required initially but no more.

 

[AllAmerican75]

There are different jobs in almost every FCA available to WTIs. Totally false. SWO bonus was required initially but no more.

Roger, I have old gouge then. I spoke with the head of SWDC a few months ago about WTIs and some other projects and he said they were still requiring you to sign the bonus in order to prevent a mass hemorrhage of knowledge. Honestly, shore duty at SWDC seems like it would be a blast.

 

[BigRed389]

Roger, I have old gouge then. I spoke with the head of SWDC a few months ago about WTIs and some other projects and he said they were still requiring you to sign the bonus in order to prevent a mass hemorrhage of knowledge. Honestly, shore duty at SWDC seems like it would be a blast.

Yeah...shore duty in San Diego to work on tactics development? FML right?

 

[azguy]

Yeah, the no-DH bonus thing is a fairly recent change. I think their logic is that even if some WTIs do decide to get out, there are enough that want to stay; the WTI thing has been going on in little known programs for years and was only formalized and brought under one roof fairly recently, but I suspect there are metrics to support the notion that people with the up-armored tactics training are more likely to stick around.

They are also likely to get a lot more applications without the bonus as a pre-req. Personally, I wasn't ready to commit to the DH bonus as a 3-yr LTJG, and I think very few are.

 

[AllAmerican75]

Yeah...shore duty in San Diego to work on tactics development? FML right?

Dude, I was willing to even come to Hampton Roads and work at the Little Creek office but San Dog would be even sweeter; well, except COMNAVHOMELANT doesn't want to go to California.

They are also likely to get a lot more applications without the bonus as a pre-req. Personally, I wasn't ready to commit to the DH bonus as a 3-yr LTJG, and I think very few are.

Yeah, I've always found it odd how we as a community push the bonus and try to get people to make a decision so early in their careers. I've got buddies who were being grilled by their COs/XOs while they were still ensigns about signing the bonus. I think it's gotten out of hand a bit.