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How To Make My Package More Competitive for SNA

Throwaway973466

New Member
This is going to be a long narrative-like post, I'm hoping for advice on a variety of things. Like everyone else I think I'm a special snowflake, thus the details. There are a couple items that are going to harm my chances, and I'm trying to figure out how to balance them out.

TL;DR: What can I do in the next 6-9 months to strengthen my package to try and counteract a shitty GPA at a prior college as well as having been prescribed Adderall.

Backgound: I'm prior enlisted, was an Aviation Electronics Technician(AT) working on EA-6B/EA-18G aircraft from 2010-2014. I had originally gone in with a Rescue Swimmer contract, successfully graduated Aircrew school, and DOR in swimmer school. To this day, this is one of my biggest regrets, not because I really wish I had become a swimmer, but because I hate that I gave up. I had pretty good evals while enlisted, the first one or two were P's, the rest were MP or EP. I made E-5 by 3.5 years, scored a perfect 80 on my E-5 exam, was a qualified plane captain, and in general an above average but not extremely exceptional sailor. Had a 95 on my ASVAB. I was bitter about where I was, but it was my own fault I was there. Took me a while to come to terms with that.

I originally started out at Oregon State University as a finance major after separation. Things were going good, was on the dean's list with above a 3.5 GPA, and was the only finance major who was taking physics that I knew of. I love physics and engineering, but wanted to get into real estate investing, which is why I chose Finance. A little ways in, I did a painting internship with College Works Painting, which went pretty well. My second year, I started my own painting company.

Half way through the season, the company failed pretty catastrophically. At the peak, I had 8 employees working for me. I had sold over $120k in residential repaints in a 7 month period. For a variety of reasons, everything went to shit. Ultimately it was my fault; I subscribe to the extreme ownership mentality. I was still going to school during this time, but the failing company and full time college was too much to manage. People paid me thousands of dollars to paint there houses, so I picked that over school. I had to miss finals to finish jobs, couldn't attend classes, I failed a bunch of stuff. My GPA tanked(this is one thing I'm worried about). I was near bankrupt from the business failure and juggling shutoff notices.

I transitioned into IT, because I was good with computers. Got hired, and switched from OSU to WGU. I still needed the extra money from the housing stipend with the G.I. Bill to make ends meet, I was only making $30k a year in IT, with a wife and two kids, in a relatively high COL area for Oregon. A few months into my new job, I was still severely struggling from the financial impact of the failure, owing the insurance company a bunch of money since I made more than I predicted for the season, and from losing thousands of dollars in labor overages as things tanked. I was working 45-50 hours a week, had a 45 min commute each way every day, had my family, and was still working on school on the weekends.

This led to thing number two which hurts my package. I was having trouble focusing at work, more than I felt I should have for how much I like IT. I went to the doctor, and after some conversations, we felt like it would be good to give Adderall a try, as undiagnosed ADHD could have been the culprit. I wasn't depressed, despite what was going on. If I had known this would have affected my chances of flying, even getting my private license, I never would have agreed to it. But I didn't know at the time.

I was on the Adderall for about 9 months, and took myself off of it. I was tired of being on the meds, and I was of the opinion that I have the capacity to do what I need to do without the use of drugs. I checked in with my doctor, who approved me going off(I had already been off for a week and was functioning fine), and handed him the half full bottle of pills that I had left from that prescription.

Currently: Now I'm almost done with my degree, and I'm coming close to the age limit for flying in the Navy. I turn 27 at the end of next July, and I know that I can extend two years for prior service. I've always wanted to fly in the military, ever since I was a kid. In my gradeschool yearbook, people called me "colonel"(spelled wrong of course) and "fly boy". Come to find out ADHD is a difficult thing to get past.

I've been doing great in school at WGU, even working full time. I completed 44 credits(semester hours) my first term. I've done great in IT; I've gone from $30k a year to almost $70k a year in barely over 18 months. I learn incredibly quickly, and excel in knowledge based things like IT. I'm currently working on my 8th professional certification for IT, and previously had competed my General Contractors license and Real Estate Brokers license. I can sit down with a text book, read it front to back in one day, and test on it the next day and pass. I did the same thing for my Economics classes at OSU.

I took the ASTB back in 2013, had 7/7/6 and 61 on the OAR. What's helping my case is my score on the ASTB was decent, I'll have a LOR from an O-6 who is now a DCAG, a LOR from my student mentor at WGU who is a retired CWO4 and been working with me for the last two years almost, and I've got pretty good leadership experience. I managed people as a Plane Captain, I managed people as an assistant night-shift sup in the AT shop, I managed people with painting, and now I'm the lead project engineer where I work, and manage IT projects costing $100k+ and the people during the completion of said projects. I also managed all the EKMS stuff for my squadron for the last 6-12 months I was there, and had 100% compliance in all audits.

I'm incredibly dedicated to what I do, and spend an ass load of personal time studying and practicing to get better. I constantly am listening to books about self improvement. If you saw me at my current job, you'd be amazed at how driven I am and what I've accomplished. I am one of the least experienced people in the company with time in IT, but am the top technical person. But I'm worried that the Adderall and poor GPA at my prior school is going to significantly hurt me, even if I've been great at WGU since(they don't have GPA to counter the OSU one, it's a competency based school).

One of the first recruiters I talked to told me to lie about the Adderall, and that there is no way in hell I would get a waiver for it, but that the Navy would never find it. I seriously considered it for a day, but then called the Chief who is the OR I'm working with and told him about the Adderall. I don't want to get into a flight position by doing the wrong thing.

The only other thing is my eyes are probably slightly worse than 20/40. It wasn't last time I tested, but that was several years ago. So I'm probably going to have to go get LASIK to be eligible. That means I've got 8-9 months between now and when I can get the LASIK waiver to make my package as bulletproof as possible. What, if anything, can I do during that time period to try and counteract the negatives that are going to be coming along with me?

I appreciate your time, I know this is a shit ton to read.
 
Last edited:

Throwaway973466

New Member
Reach out to a Local OR, way too many questions and I’m not in the mood to try to detangle any of this.
Fair enough, I appreciate your time. I'm already working with an OR, all they've suggested for me so far is getting some LOR from college professors that I've had. I tend to go all in, so I'm looking for something more than that.
 

AROBLES93

Underdog
This is going to be a long narrative-like post, I'm hoping for advice on a variety of things. Like everyone else I think I'm a special snowflake, thus the details. There are a couple items that are going to harm my chances, and I'm trying to figure out how to balance them out.

TL;DR: What can I do in the next 6-9 months to strengthen my package to try and counteract a shitty GPA at a prior college as well as having been prescribed Adderall.

Backgound: I'm prior enlisted, was an Aviation Electronics Technician(AT) working on EA-6B/EA-18G aircraft from 2010-2014. I had originally gone in with a Rescue Swimmer contract, successfully graduated Aircrew school, and DOR in swimmer school. To this day, this is one of my biggest regrets, not because I really wish I had become a swimmer, but because I hate that I gave up. I had pretty good evals while enlisted, the first one or two were P's, the rest were MP or EP. I made E-5 by 3.5 years, scored a perfect 80 on my E-5 exam, was a qualified plane captain, and in general an above average but not extremely exceptional sailor. Had a 95 on my ASVAB. I was bitter about where I was, but it was my own fault I was there. Took me a while to come to terms with that.

I originally started out at Oregon State University as a finance major after separation. Things were going good, was on the dean's list with above a 3.5 GPA, and was the only finance major who was taking physics that I knew of. I love physics and engineering, but wanted to get into real estate investing, which is why I chose Finance. A little ways in, I did a painting internship with College Works Painting, which went pretty well. My second year, I started my own painting company.

Half way through the season, the company failed pretty catastrophically. At the peak, I had 8 employees working for me. I had sold over $120k in residential repaints in a 7 month period. For a variety of reasons, everything went to shit. Ultimately it was my fault; I subscribe to the extreme ownership mentality. I was still going to school during this time, but the failing company and full time college was too much to manage. People paid me thousands of dollars to paint there houses, so I picked that over school. I had to miss finals to finish jobs, couldn't attend classes, I failed a bunch of stuff. My GPA tanked(this is one thing I'm worried about). I was near bankrupt from the business failure and juggling shutoff notices.

I transitioned into IT, because I was good with computers. Got hired, and switched from OSU to WGU. I still needed the extra money from the housing stipend with the G.I. Bill to make ends meet, I was only making $30k a year in IT, with a wife and two kids, in a relatively high COL area for Oregon. A few months into my new job, I was still severely struggling from the financial impact of the failure, owing the insurance company a bunch of money since I made more than I predicted for the season, and from losing thousands of dollars in labor overages as things tanked. I was working 45-50 hours a week, had a 45 min commute each way every day, had my family, and was still working on school on the weekends.

This led to thing number two which hurts my package. I was having trouble focusing at work, more than I felt I should have for how much I like IT. I went to the doctor, and after some conversations, we felt like it would be good to give Adderall a try, as undiagnosed ADHD could have been the culprit. I wasn't depressed, despite what was going on. If I had known this would have affected my chances of flying, even getting my private license, I never would have agreed to it. But I didn't know at the time.

I was on the Adderall for about 9 months, and took myself off of it. I was tired of being on the meds, and I was of the opinion that I have the capacity to do what I need to do without the use of drugs. I checked in with my doctor, who approved me going off(I had already been off for a week and was functioning fine), and handed him the half full bottle of pills that I had left from that prescription.

Currently: Now I'm almost done with my degree, and I'm coming close to the age limit for flying in the Navy. I turn 27 at the end of next July, and I know that I can extend two years for prior service. I've always wanted to fly in the military, ever since I was a kid. In my gradeschool yearbook, people called me "colonel"(spelled wrong of course) and "fly boy". Come to find out ADHD is a difficult thing to get past.

I've been doing great in school at WGU, even working full time. I completed 44 credits(semester hours) my first term. I've done great in IT; I've gone from $30k a year to almost $70k a year in barely over 18 months. I learn incredibly quickly, and excel in knowledge based things like IT. I'm currently working on my 8th professional certification for IT, and previously had competed my General Contractors license and Real Estate Brokers license. I can sit down with a text book, read it front to back in one day, and test on it the next day and pass. I did the same thing for my Economics classes at OSU.

I took the ASTB back in 2013, had 7/7/6 and 61 on the OAR. What's helping my case is my score on the ASTB was decent, I'll have a LOR from an O-6 who is now a DCAG, a LOR from my student mentor at WGU who is a retired CWO4 and been working with me for the last two years almost, and I've got pretty good leadership experience. I managed people as a Plane Captain, I managed people as an assistant night-shift sup in the AT shop, I managed people with painting, and now I'm the lead project engineer where I work, and manage IT projects costing $100k+ and the people during the completion of said projects. I also managed all the EKMS stuff for my squadron for the last 6-12 months I was there, and had 100% compliance in all audits.

I'm incredibly dedicated to what I do, and spend an ass load of personal time studying and practicing to get better. I constantly am listening to books about self improvement. If you saw me at my current job, you'd be amazed at how driven I am and what I've accomplished. I am one of the least experienced people in the company with time in IT, but am the top technical person. But I'm worried that the Adderall and poor GPA at my prior school is going to significantly hurt me, even if I've been great at WGU since(they don't have GPA to counter the OSU one, it's a competency based school).

One of the first recruiters I talked to told me to lie about the Adderall, and that there is no way in hell I would get a waiver for it, but that the Navy would never find it. I seriously considered it for a day, but then called the Chief who is the OR I'm working with and told him about the Adderall. I don't want to get into a flight position by doing the wrong thing.

The only other thing is my eyes are probably slightly worse than 20/40. It wasn't last time I tested, but that was several years ago. So I'm probably going to have to go get LASIK to be eligible. That means I've got 8-9 months between now and when I can get the LASIK waiver to make my package as bulletproof as possible. What, if anything, can I do during that time period to try and counteract the negatives that are going to be coming along with me?

I appreciate your time, I know this is a shit ton to read.

What squadron were you in?
Also, although getting an 80 on your exam is something to brag about I’m pretty sure that doesn’t show any leadership nor an assistant night check supervisor.
 

Throwaway973466

New Member
What squadron were you in?
Also, although getting an 80 on your exam is something to brag about I’m pretty sure that doesn’t show any leadership nor an assistant night check supervisor.
VAQ-137

Trust me, I normally don't even mention the 80, though I am proud of it. The only reason I mentioned here is the general thing I've read about the ADHD stuff is they want to make sure you can effectively learn without it.
 

AROBLES93

Underdog
VAQ-137

Trust me, I normally don't even mention the 80, though I am proud of it. The only reason I mentioned here is the general thing I've read about the ADHD stuff is they want to make sure you can effectively learn without it.

Right on,
Well I wish you luck brother. I was at VAQ136 around that time .
As far as the ADHD, try to use the search function. I know I recently saw a thread regarding the ins and outs of how to get a waiver for it ( but I remember it didn’t seem like an easy task)
 

Throwaway973466

New Member
Right on,
Well I wish you luck brother. I was at VAQ136 around that time .
As far as the ADHD, try to use the search function. I know I recently saw a thread regarding the ins and outs of how to get a waiver for it ( but I remember it didn’t seem like an easy task)
The posts I've come up with reference a 3 year wait time, but I haven't been able to find anything official over the 1 year mentioned in the pubs. I haven't seen anything about ins and outs of getting a waiver, but I'll definitely look more.

Thanks!
 

FormerRecruitingGuru

Making Recruiting Great Again
The posts I've come up with reference a 3 year wait time, but I haven't been able to find anything official over the 1 year mentioned in the pubs. I haven't seen anything about ins and outs of getting a waiver, but I'll definitely look more.

Thanks!

Google "MANMED Chapter 15" and you'll easily find your answer.
 

Throwaway973466

New Member
I'm looking at this version, which says it was updated June 2018: https://www.med.navy.mil/directives...145, 150-152, 154-156, 160, 164, and 165).pdf

I also reviewed a version from 2016.

"ADHD" appears five times in the document across 3 paragraphs:

15-45: (9) Current or history of Attention Deficit Disorder/ Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder (ADD/ ADHD) (314), or perceptual/learning disorder(s) (315) is disqualifying unless applicant can demonstrate passing academic performance and there has been no use of medication(s) or special accommodations in the previous 12 months.

15-81: (a) Current attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) which requires medication to control symptoms, is disqualifying, but a history of ADHD which resolved greater than 1 year prior to military service is not disqualifying.

15-106: (a) Current ADHD which requires medication to control symptoms, is disqualifying, but a history of ADHD which resolved greater than 1 year prior to military service is not disqualifying.

I'm not trying to be obtuse or argumentative, but I'm not seeing anything mentioning 3 years except the posts on this website.
 

FormerRecruitingGuru

Making Recruiting Great Again
I'm looking at this version, which says it was updated June 2018: https://www.med.navy.mil/directives/Documents/NAVMED P-117 (MANMED)/Chapter 15 Medical Examinations (incorporates Changes 126, 135-138, 140, 145, 150-152, 154-156, 160, 164, and 165).pdf

I also reviewed a version from 2016.

"ADHD" appears five times in the document across 3 paragraphs:

15-45: (9) Current or history of Attention Deficit Disorder/ Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder (ADD/ ADHD) (314), or perceptual/learning disorder(s) (315) is disqualifying unless applicant can demonstrate passing academic performance and there has been no use of medication(s) or special accommodations in the previous 12 months.

15-81: (a) Current attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) which requires medication to control symptoms, is disqualifying, but a history of ADHD which resolved greater than 1 year prior to military service is not disqualifying.

15-106: (a) Current ADHD which requires medication to control symptoms, is disqualifying, but a history of ADHD which resolved greater than 1 year prior to military service is not disqualifying.

I'm not trying to be obtuse or argumentative, but I'm not seeing anything mentioning 3 years except the posts on this website.

You are absolutely "Nuking" this.
 
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