AttackCanary
Active Member
Haha, because engineers are so well known for their grooming capabilities
But you are probably right....
Go Gators!
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Female applicants and haircuts
- Thread starter FormerRecruitingGuru
- Start date
Haha, because engineers are so well known for their grooming capabilities
But you are probably right....
Go Gators!
Steve:
She was referring to your previous post about GENDER EQUALITY.
Workingoutsidemyfield:
You really need to figure out how to write more clearly and succinctly. I too was lost on both of your posts.
Workingoutsidemyfield
Active Member
My 2 cents on the matter is this: males get their hair cut. After that, it takes them about a month (more or less) to grow there hair back to how they would want to keep it (within regs that is). Females get their hair cut at OCS. If they are like me, my hair it typically kept below shoulder length. If I we're to get my hair chopped at OCS, that would be around 6-8 inches cut off. That could take 2-3 years to get my hair back to they way I would want to wear it.
Now, would I get my hair cut if they told me to? Absolutly, without question. I want to be a naval officer more than I would want to keep my long hair. Do I see that this could create more hassle at OCS? Yes I do. I do believe grooming standards should be taught at OCS. I like to think that I am an intelligent female. However, I do struggle with making a bun. You can't just watch a YouTube video and learn how to do your hair.
Gender equality, also my two cents. If I were implementing this for females at OCS, I would also implement a policy that said males would not be forced to get theirs done as long as they stayed within regs.
This would make me happy if it continues because I would love to graduate OCS without looking like a half sheared sheepdog.
Now, would I get my hair cut if they told me to? Absolutly, without question. I want to be a naval officer more than I would want to keep my long hair. Do I see that this could create more hassle at OCS? Yes I do. I do believe grooming standards should be taught at OCS. I like to think that I am an intelligent female. However, I do struggle with making a bun. You can't just watch a YouTube video and learn how to do your hair.
Gender equality, also my two cents. If I were implementing this for females at OCS, I would also implement a policy that said males would not be forced to get theirs done as long as they stayed within regs.
This would make me happy if it continues because I would love to graduate OCS without looking like a half sheared sheepdog.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
This is all missing the point of why candidates get haircuts in the first place - to strip candidates of their individuality as part of teaching the class to function as a cohesive unit. You will probably be one of only a handful of women in an otherwise predominantly male class. While it's a seemingly minor symbol, the fact that your long hair is wrapped neatly in a bun while the men around you are bald with scratches no longer makes you the same as them, in both their eyes and the eyes of the staff. On one of the first days of training, your experience will already be different from theirs - you will not have sat in that chair for 10 minutes while some disgruntled barber takes a sharp object and digs it into your skull to the point that it scratches you, while simultaneously still managing to miss spots.
I personally think that teamwork lesson is far more important than sparing you the trouble of finding an ENS/LTJG 6-12 months after graduation and whispering "hey, about that bun...how do you actually do that?"
I personally think that teamwork lesson is far more important than sparing you the trouble of finding an ENS/LTJG 6-12 months after graduation and whispering "hey, about that bun...how do you actually do that?"
I understand that the purpose of getting hair cuts is to limit individuality. However, this is accomplished in several different ways while at OCS (from my understanding). In all seriousness, has anyone ever graduated OCS and said that the single most import lesson taught to them there was through getting their hair cut or head shaved?
NROTCs are presently forbidden to have anyone's hair cut in any specific way. They're only allowed to mandate that candidates (in Orientation Week or at other times) get their hair in regs or suffer consequences. There are other ways for candidates to share sacrifice and work as a unit. We will survive losing or degrading this one.
Steve's point, and what Spekkio is pointing out, is that fleet regs don't mean anything to you, as a candidate. Guy or girl, you haven't rated fleet regs to be applied to you. So if a guy has to be put into a hair situation that considerably exceeds the fleet standard, why not females?
That said, education on how to tame your locks probably isn't a bad idea so you don't end up looking like the cat lady...and yes, I can cite an example that I run into fairly regularly.
I know, but I was hoping she could clarify the gouges and nonsenses that I speak of on the interwebs.
Truth
Don't do that. There are more productive things to do to tame your frustrations.
Less
No, sorry.
What makes you think you'll be able to learn this skill at OCS? Besides, you can learn how to do anything on YouTube. Give it a try.
You are so missing the point of all this. Getting your hair cut (or shaved for men) upon starting boot camp or officer training is a rite of passage, a ritual that the military has had for a very long time.
This as well.
Just stop.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
OCS and NROTC are almost apples and oranges the way that they approach training officer candidates, if for no other reason than the time difference.
Yes, the military will survive, it's just another aspect of the training that is now eroded... and how do you think the male candidates are going to react to the female candidates complaining about the time it takes to put up a bun when they each just paid $10 to get their heads shaved? You're taking men who have been in the military for a day or two and already teaching them that exceptions are made for women.
No, but it's hard to point to any one thing at OCS and say "that...that's the MOST important thing we did." It's the whole experience put together. OCS is taking you from civilian life and molding you into an Ensign in 12 weeks, and every little idiosyncracy that they do there has the purpose of acheiving that goal.
I highly respect you argument. Especially the part about getting in and figuring out from day one that there are exceptions for women. If I were a guy, I would be ticked. And I also understand that this is a rite of passage in its own way. Like I said before, if they tell me to cut my hair I will smile and go along with it. I don't see it as something that will be that big of a deal to me. The biggest thing that would suck for me personally would be not being able to secure my hair to my head during PT if it were cut. I've been an athlete my entire life and that would drive me absolutely crazy having my hair in my face while exercising. At that point, I would almost want them to shave my head. But, I would deal with it. My intent with my original message was to just relay the information I found about the possibility of the regs changing at OCS. My other messages were just my 2 cents and nothing more. (And I did get it wrong, excuse me. It would take roughly a year to a year and a half to grow my hair out the 6-8 inches they would cut.)
Boot camp, Great Lakes 1964, I showed up a bright-eyed and bushy-tailed kid with a bunch of other guys from all over the country. I mustered in, noticed how I was a country bumpkin and started to worry a bit about my surroundings. Within a few days we were indoctrinated, fitted for uniforms and received our (heads shaved) haircuts. Funny how we all started to feel a bit like shipmates. (Good to see you back, BzB. I'm sad about Ron.)
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PettyOfficerCJ
Well-Known Member
Why is it that when someone is whining about "gender equality" in appearances, it is always assumed that the females need to look like males for equality to be accomplished?? Pretty sure you'd hear an uproar from men in the military if they were required to maintain female hair standards.....do away with the men's different standard, and we'll all follow the women's..... that would be equal too, right?? Oh, and while we're at it let's conduct surgeries so that everyone has the same gender neutral bodies too...... might have to do some genetic restructuring, but the outcome would be worth it....
(oh, and some men may complain about a one-time bad haircut/shave that results in a few nicks, but most men seem to like it that women survive a life-time of cuts and knicks in order to have nicely shaved legs.....pretty sure if there were no men in the USA, the amount of hairy legged women would appear in much greater numbers....oh and furry eyebrows, women don't take plyers to their faces everyday to pull out hair for nothing.......)
(oh, and some men may complain about a one-time bad haircut/shave that results in a few nicks, but most men seem to like it that women survive a life-time of cuts and knicks in order to have nicely shaved legs.....pretty sure if there were no men in the USA, the amount of hairy legged women would appear in much greater numbers....oh and furry eyebrows, women don't take plyers to their faces everyday to pull out hair for nothing.......)
PettyOfficerCJ
Well-Known Member
*nicks