(Dumb questions about) Mil to Civ Helo thread

[Gatordev]

I know we've had several commercial threads that have either tangentially and/or out-right talked about COM helo jobs, but I don't recall a thread that specifically addresses the "dumb questions" portion. Since I own the dumb question bus, I figured I'd get this started here. I know we don't have a ton of COM helo guys here, but figured I'd start the process...

So I've registered with HAI and plan to attend the 2017 HeliExpo in Dallas. I've done some initial "research" with some other (EMS) helo dudes I know, but trying to figure the simple logistics of a conference are up for grabs. So here goes some dumb conference questions and I welcome discussion...

1) I've signed up for both the "Mil to Civ Training" class and the show floor access. Obviously walking around the show floor, I want to look spectacular, but do I also need a suit for the training class? Given the number of "mentors" supposedly in attendance, it seems like the right thing to do, but just checking.

2) I'm starting a little early (more than 15 months prior to retirement date). I know networking is the key, but if I haven't had the "Mil-to-Civ" training, so do I show up with my possibly less-than-stellar resume on the show floor? I've done some research, and can certainly do a REV 1 resume, but initially, I'm just a country bumpkin dropped into the big city of a conference hall and don't know what I don't know.

3) Conference Hall day: So I've had my class and the next day I'm like Kwai Chang Caine on a Kung Fu quest, given I don't know what I don't know, how valuable is my resume? I mean seriously, every swinging dick is going to be trying to angle for a job with any Chief Pilot on the floor, but what's the angle here? Again, given I have a little time.

4) Business cards. Right or wrong, I still don't have my CFII/Helo II. So shoot me. But I'll work towards that. Given that, if I make up business cards now, how much will it hurt me not having that on my cards? I know this is a short-term question, but figured I'd ask.

I probably have a few others, but I'm blanking. I welcome any thoughts for those who have been through the gauntlet before.

 

[Randy Daytona]

I've worked for 3 helicopter companies so I will pass along what I have seen.

Connections, connections, connections - leverage your friends and/or reservists flying in the civilian world

You will not need a suit for training classes

The big numbers they will want to see are:
1) Total helo time - and total helo PIC time
2) Total multi-engine time - and total multi-engine PIC time
3) Night time - and NVG time
4) Instrument time
5) Instructor time
6) Helicopter ATP (or commercial) and Helicopter Instrument (do not take chances - be specific - see below).
7) Type ratings / helicopters you have flown (I put both civilian and military designations)

Nice to have are:
1) Water survival training
2) Security clearance
3) CFI/CFII
4) Ship landings / time at sea flying

I have seen things that HR did: returning a resume because the prospective pilot put ATP, not Helicopter ATP - also a pilot put he had Boeing H-47 time and HR threw it in the trash because Boeing makes airplanes and we are looking for helicopter pilots. Be very specific with your ratings - but use bullet points and keep it short. Nobody will care that you managed accounts worth $xxxx million dollars, etc - especially if it is a long winded paragraph (1 page will be plenty)

If I can be of any assistance, give me a shout. Best of luck.

 

[Renegade One]

Outsider looking in sez:
1. Wear your uniform…NOT a flight suit. SDBs are your business suit equivalent. You'll look spectacular and stand out from the civ crowd. Assuming the training class is on the show site, same recommendation. Strut your stuff.
P.S.: I note that the training stuff is on a different day? That might change my answer to business casual for that. You know…"Service Dress Hinge" with a blazer. The cordovan tassle loafers "play"… No one ever got kicked out of class for dressing too well.

2. Have SOME kind of resume in hand, even if it only shows your T/M/S and hours in each. Don't forget the other basics: education; past leadership positions; current assignment; position sought; projected availability date, etc. Include a good headshot photo ("Oh, yeah…I remember this guy…"). Make sure YOU get business cars in return. If you have any meaningful discussions with anyone, a TY note or e-mail several days later never hurts. Short and sweet, "Thanks for the time…", etc. Keep it classy.

3. SAA

4. Business card with NA wings, your name and T/M/S credentials on it, with contact info (cell phone and e-mail address). Too much BS can be just that. FAA quals if you have them; don't sweat what you don't yet have.

That's my $.02 from the cheap seats, but I spent a lot of days on the receiving end of "at the booth" transitioning elevator speeches, and nothing counts quite so much as a good, strong first impression.

 

[Randy Daytona]

Outsider looking in sez:
1. Wear your uniform…NOT a flight suit. SDBs are your business suit equivalent. You'll look spectacular and stand out from the civ crowd. Assuming the training class is on the show site, same recommendation. Strut your stuff.
P.S.: I note that the training stuff is on a different day? That might change my answer to business casual for that. You know…"Service Dress Hinge" with a blazer. The cordovan tassle loafers "play"… No one ever got kicked out of class for dressing too well.

2. Have SOME kind of resume in hand, even if it only shows your T/M/S and hours in each. Don't forget the other basics: education; past leadership positions; current assignment; position sought; projected availability date, etc. Include a good headshot photo ("Oh, yeah…I remember this guy…"). Make sure YOU get business cars in return. If you have any meaningful discussions with anyone, a TY note or e-mail several days later never hurts. Short and sweet, "Thanks for the time…", etc. Keep it classy.

3. SAA

4. Business card with NA wings, your name and T/M/S credentials on it, with contact info (cell phone and e-mail address). Too much BS can be just that. FAA quals if you have them; don't sweat what you don't yet have.

That's my $.02 from the cheap seats, but I spent a lot of days on the receiving end of "at the booth" transitioning elevator speeches, and nothing counts quite so much as a good, strong first impression.

I respectfully, and completely, disagree with the items highlighted above - don't know what #3 is.

By the way, if you are in the DFW area, these are the places you want to eat:

http://www.hardeightbbq.com/
https://www.bonedaddys.com/

Never made it here but was very popular with others:
http://redneckheaven.com/

 

[Gatordev]

1. Wear your uniform…NOT a flight suit. SDBs are your business suit equivalent. You'll look spectacular and stand out from the civ crowd. Assuming the training class is on the show site, same recommendation. Strut your stuff.

So this seems to be universally the worst idea ever, from my research. It would be bold, though, I'll give you that. Not sure what SAA is.

Thanks, Randy. I figured you'd chime in. Just wasn't sure how many others were out there on the site. I'm actually a little relieved about not having to play dress up for the training session.

As for time...crap. I had lots of stuff split up already, but looks like I need to go in and break up my helo PIC time a little more. Easy to do with my spreadsheet now, but thanks for the pointer.

 

[Griz882]

If you are even thinking about a Fed Gov flying job have a separate resume that includes (yes, it sounds stupid) number of hours worked per week. Just put 40 or 60 hours. Remember, to the HR jockey, the job isn't just about flying but all your duties. If the numbers aren't there for each job, the HR folks will dump your application no matter how qualified you are.

As for civy-street, Randy has his ducks in a row...follow his advice.

 

[Gatordev]

4) Ship landings / time at sea flying

Okay, another question... This data is easy to pull, but it's split up between 7 different types of boat landings. Do you recommend just doing "Day," "Night," and "NVD" and then just totaling each type of landing within each category? I know there's Navy guys out there that will know the difference between the different types, but I doubt anyone cares how many times I've speared the trap versus just putting it down in the big-ass circle.

Although if I do that, how will I bring the subject the Donkey Dick into the conversation?

 

[Randy Daytona]

Okay, another question... This data is easy to pull, but it's split up between 7 different types of boat landings. Do you recommend just doing "Day," "Night," and "NVD" and then just totaling each type of landing within each category? I know there's Navy guys out there that will know the difference between the different types, but I doubt anyone cares how many times I've speared the trap versus just putting it down in the big-ass circle.

Although if I do that, how will I bring the subject the Donkey Dick into the conversation?

Keep it simple: day, night and nvg landings for the boat.

Other observations from the civilian world:

There appears to be 3 basic rivalries of new hire helicopter pilots: Army, Naval Aviation and civilian. Needless to say, if you show up in a Navy uniform, that puts you at a disadvantage to the hiring guys who are Army and civilian. After several years, everybody tends to blend together. Also, don't put your rank on your resume.

Every 293 or 297 check ride, I always had to define the Big 3: settling with power, ground resonance, and dynamic rollover.

I would recommend going through the AIM/FAR and setting up a gouge sheet, with at least 1 page denoting the differences between Part 91 and Part 135 weather requirements. Really study civilian regs....

Come up to speed on WAAS approaches such as LPV's LP's etc as well taking a looking at 4 axis autopilots (if you don't have any experience with them already.)

Depending on the company, study some CRM, Safety, HR buzzwords. The one helo job I did not get was due to a 24 year old Safety guy and a 25 year old HR lady (neither of which were pilots) not scoring my answers high enough on their questions. (Turned out better in the end anyway...)

As for the Donkey Dick, you could mention it in reference to the EC-135 hydraulic pump... Speaking of which, remember the last number in a Eurocopter denotes the number of engines: "0" means one engine, "5" means two engines.

 

[Gatordev]

Also, don't put your rank on your resume.

Oh God, no. And probably exponentially worse for me with where I managed to end up at by some weird planet alignment.

"0" means one engine, "5" means two engines.

I didn't realize that. Daily intelligence increased. Oh wait, I've got Scotch sitting with me. Let's just call it even.

Come up to speed on WAAS approaches such as LPV's LP's etc as well taking a looking at 4 axis autopilots (if you don't have any experience with them already.)

So here comes some basic general knowledge exposure... On the civilian side, my (very limited) understanding is that the 4-axis AP will compute the decel given the inputted approach to the system resulting in a zero/DH approach (or is it a Safe single/DH approach?). So here's some questions (and I may move this to another thread to keep this fairly clean):

- I have zero experience playing with this setup, but I can understand the basic concept given how good our AFCS is for coupled approaches. What's the best way to get exposure? Seems like getting access to an airframe that has this capability would be tough in a local area. Does it matter? Is it something as "simple" as some sort of WINGS program training?

- My intent with my first visit to the expo is to learn about the universe in which I'm trying to enter and maybe some mild networking. Maybe I should be more bold, but I still have a relatively large amount of time left before retiring (15 months). Will studying up on all the 91/135/GPS/etc stuff really matter at this point? I'm not saying I'm lazy, but...I do have a bunch of other crap I've got going on right now, so trying to balance everything.

- I really need to sit down and study the CFII stuff. No question, just something I need to get completed.

 

[Randy Daytona]

Also for the Eurocopters (prior to the Airbus reorganization). In Europe, the first number denotes civ/mil: "1" means civilian, "6" means military. The second number is max gross either in tons or 1,000 kilos (can't remember). Thus EC-135 is a civilian, 3 ton, twin engine.

If you are flying glass now, you are fine. Even basic concepts of coupled approaches with the autopilot controlling the collective is plenty good - I wouldn't worry about it or the Part 91 / Part 135 stuff until you get much closer to joining the civilian market. Go ahead and have another Scotch.

 

[Gatordev]

Go ahead and have another Scotch.

#winning

 

[phrogdriver]

For the love of everything holy, don't wear SDBs/Service As/etc.

Wear a suit if a real interview. For a job fair/trade show environment, business casual is probably appropriate.

The knowledge required will very by employer. Suffice it to say, I was surprised by some FAR stuff on my first civ interview. If you don't know, then study.

Business cards can't hurt for a conference environment.

If you want to fly for LE, Baltimore will have openings in the next several months. PM if you want to know more.

 

[Gatordev]

Thanks. I think I'd like to fly for LE, but I have zero desire to move to MD. Since the conference is in Dallas, I'm hoping the Ft. Worth PD is there. It would be interesting to ask if their 206 requirement is truly hard and fast.

 

[phrogdriver]

Thanks. I think I'd like to fly for LE, but I have zero desire to move to MD. Since the conference is in Dallas, I'm hoping the Ft. Worth PD is there. It would be interesting to ask if their 206 requirement is truly hard and fast.

Well, I did their phone interview and tanked it. I'm a 1000 hour 206 guy and I couldn't answer some of the questions on that front. "If your Ng gauge isn't working, what's the likely problem?" Oh fuck, man. Is this FAM 10?

LE is a cool mission, but you'd be shocked how soon you get used to car, motorcycle, and foot chases. Make sure the department is one that's good to work for.