First flight of the P-8A Poseidon and all things related to transition

[nittany03]

So...how many will get P-8's????

 

[PropAddict]

Seriously? Come on, Boeing, you're selling the Multi-Mission Maritime Aircraft. Could you at least give us some concept plane pr0n with a friggin' ocean in the background? Maybe a boat? Something nautical?

Considering the current mission set, even going low over a desert with some camels would sorta make sense.

But 30Kft over snow-capped mountains? :icon_rage

 

[NozeMan]

84 total aircraft for 12 Fleet squadrons and an FRS. Thats not a whole lot of aircraft for each fleet squadron, when you take into account the FRS. Figure 6 for each squadron and 12 for the FRS, that adds up to 84. How long will it take a squadron to fly the wings off of 6 aircraft?

Is Boeing going to hook you guys up with a sweet sim to get all your training? Not trying to stir the pot, but when you take into account how long the P-3 has been in service, the Patrol community is going to have make these 84 plans last a LONG time.

 

[PropAddict]

How long will it take a squadron to fly the wings off of 6 aircraft?

Word on the street is BAMS will take care of this problem. Each MMA will fly with a team of automated wing men.

You know: if they can ever get it (BAMS) off the ground.

the Patrol community is going to have make these 84 plans last a LONG time.

True. But BAMS should be able to suck up the major stresses and be a (relatively) low-cost force multiplier that helps out here.

 

[Flash]

When was the buy reduced from 108 to 84? The first number was the one that I saw for years until HJ's post.

And one very easy way to ease the stress on the P-8 fleet would be to buy used 737's as training aircraft, they already have done that for the E-6 RAG.

 

[NozeMan]

When was the buy reduced from 108 to 84? The first number was the one that I saw for years until HJ's post.

And one very easy way to ease the stress on the P-8 fleet would be to buy used 737's as training aircraft, they already have done that for the E-6 RAG.

That'd give each squadron a whopping 7 aircraft to play with. Even if the BAMS thing does get rolling, the bigger picture is that Maritime guys will have to fly the aircraft less to preserve it and let the UAVs do part of the job. How many hours would you actually get in the aircraft?

 

[Flash]

That'd give each squadron a whopping 7 aircraft to play with. Even if the BAMS thing does get rolling, the bigger picture is that Maritime guys will have to fly the aircraft less to preserve it and let the UAVs do part of the job. How many hours would you actually get in the aircraft?

The Navy could buy however as many needed or could afford, who said anything about one extra per squadron? You will probably see much more usage of simulators, especially for the front end. As for the number of hours, it may be less but that will probably be a fact of life across the board.

 

[HeyJoe]

That'd give each squadron a whopping 7 aircraft to play with. Even if the BAMS thing does get rolling, the bigger picture is that Maritime guys will have to fly the aircraft less to preserve it and let the UAVs do part of the job.

Here's what the final report says in that regard:

The proposed action is to provide facilities and functions that support homebasing of the P-8A MMA at established maritime patrol homebases. The proposed action would, at program’s completion, replace 120 P-3C aircraft (12 fleet squadrons, 108 fleet aircraft, plus one fleet replacement squadron [FRS] with 12 aircraft) with a total of 84 P-8A MMA (12 fleet squadrons, 72 fleet aircraft, plus one FRS squadron with 12 aircraft) split primarily between East and West Coasts, with a continued presence in Hawaii and periodic detachments at NAS North Island, California, to support training requirements. Additionally, the FRS would be co-located at one of the continental U.S. Main Operations Bases (MOBs).

Under the proposed action, each fleet squadron would consist of 6 aircraft, 12 crews, and 35 supporting personnel. Each crew would be composed of five officers and four enlisted personnel. In total, a fleet squadron would require 143 personnel. An FRS consists of 12 aircraft and the appropriate complement of instructors to train officers and enlisted personnel. In total, the FRS would require 417 personnel.

There is a novel approach at play here with lower number of aircraft per squadron and considerably less personnel to maintain it. Boeing sold the concept based on Airliner legacy support. I have no doubts that many eyes will be on the forst squadrons to transition comparing what was predicting with what actually happens. There will be plenty of time while production line is still hot to add more for pipeline or attrition or whatever. India is close to buying some and there will likely be an EP-3 replacement based on the P-8A now that Army fell on their faces with ACS so the line will be open for forseeable future (Boeing will likely work hard to ensure it stays that way).

Seriously? Come on, Boeing, you're selling the Multi-Mission Maritime Aircraft. Could you at least give us some concept plane pr0n with a friggin' ocean in the background? Maybe a boat? Something nautical?

Considering the current mission set, even going low over a desert with some camels would sorta make sense.

But 30Kft over snow-capped mountains?

As to picture, I chose that one because I see the "other" one every time I drive to Pax and this was a refreshing change. I willing to bet it was to show a Himalayan type background perhaps (in support of prposal to India perhaps?). How's these two^^vv?

 

[NozeMan]

The Navy could buy however as many needed or could afford, who said anything about one extra per squadron? You will probably see much more usage of simulators, especially for the front end. As for the number of hours, it may be less but that will probably be a fact of life across the board.

According to HeyJoe's post, I'm right And my logic was based on simple division, apparently the Navy's is as well.


I think I've heard something about high quality 737 simulators being used for the commercial world. I'd think this would have obvious applications with the P-8 FRS and the fleet guys as well.

 

[HeyJoe]

That'd give each squadron a whopping 7 aircraft to play with.

Under the proposed action, each fleet squadron would consist of 6 aircraft

According to HeyJoe's post, I'm right. And my logic was based on simple division, apparently the Navy's is as well.

Maybe you should have tried working it the other way (multiplication: 6 x 12 = 72 in Fleet Squadrons + 12 in FRS = 84)

 

[NozeMan]

Maybe you should have tried working it the other way (multiplication: 6 x 12 = 72 in Fleet Squadrons + 12 in FRS = 84)

Looks like we are splitting hairs here!


I did my P-8 math based on the FRS having double the aircraft of the normal squadrons. Guess and check works wonders, thats how I came up with 6 a/c in a fleet squadron and 12 in the FRS....just like you

 

[Hozer]

That'd give each squadron a whopping 7 aircraft to play with. Even if the BAMS thing does get rolling, the bigger picture is that Maritime guys will have to fly the aircraft less to preserve it and let the UAVs do part of the job. How many hours would you actually get in the aircraft?

Opposed to the 4 up aircraft Wing Eleven had in total last time I was over there...anything's an improvement at this point.

 

[phrogdriver]

Can't wait to get my hands on that sweet jet...

I don't want to be the guy calling someone else's baby ugly, but, uh, it's an airliner. Do you get aroused flying Southwest? :icon_wink

At least it's a 1960s airliner and not a 1950s airliner, though.

 

[scoolbubba]

I don't want to be the guy calling someone else's baby ugly, but, uh, it's an airliner. Do you get aroused flying Southwest? :icon_wink

At least it's a 1960s airliner and not a 1950s airliner, though.

Certainly not by their flight attendants.

 

[Flugelman]

Certainly not by their flight attendants.

Once upon a time, yeah. Now, not so much...