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Navy proposes giving sailors 3 years off

ea6bflyr

Working Class Bum
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Here's the S&S Article.

I'm interested if anyone would be interested in taking the Navy up on the offer.

The catch: you would be required to pay back 2 months for every month taken. Of course, this is still a proposal for the 2009 National Defense Authorization Act.

-ea6bflyr ;)
 

snake020

Contributor
The Air Force has a program called educational leave of absence. (used to be called bootstrap) where you can take time off to work on your bachelor's or postgrad degree. You get paid your base pay and keep your medical, but you don't get any allowances to include BAH and BAS, and the payback is the same, 2 to 1. However, it's considered a career killer because of 2 years of unobserved FITREPS.

The Coast Guard has this.

On the officer side I think it might not be a bad deal if they can freeze your time in service and push your promotion zone window out, otherwise I don't see a lot of participation.
 

statesman

Shut up woman... get on my horse.
pilot
I wonder how this would affect advancement.

Ive been told that if you take time to go and get a masters degree (I think they call it "in residence"? maybe Im wrong) it can really hurt your ability to advance, especially for pilots.
 

Scoob

If you gotta problem, yo, I'll be part of it.
pilot
Contributor
On the officer side I think it might not be a bad deal if they can freeze your time in service and push your promotion zone window out, otherwise I don't see a lot of participation.
Now THAT is a fantastic idea. It could be known as LDEP. Lobotomization Delayed Entry Program. Could we get that in a sabatical-free option? JESP. JOPA Extended Service Program.
 

IKE

Nerd Whirler
pilot
Sounds like STA-21.

Just take away the full pay, $10k/year for college, continued tenure, and that whole 'commission' thing...
 

hscs

Registered User
pilot
I wonder how this would affect advancement.

Ive been told that if you take time to go and get a masters degree (I think they call it "in residence"? maybe Im wrong) it can really hurt your ability to advance, especially for pilots.

According to the article, you will slide back in year groups -- go from 2001 to 2003 if you were to take a 2 year break. This isn't all education -- this is a drive to allow women to make it to the higher ranks. One of the largest roadblocks to more women making it up the food chain is a decision to have a child.
 

Uncle Fester

Robot Pimp
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
...This isn't all education -- this is a drive to allow women to make it to the higher ranks. One of the largest roadblocks to more women making it up the food chain is a decision to have a child.

Oh, boy, here we go. Tapes on, fight's on. :icon_tong
 

usmarinemike

Solidly part of the 42%.
pilot
Contributor
It seems like someone up there is at least trying to make a valiant effort to improve QOL, but I have some issues with this one.

1) Who decides who gets to take the time off? When it comes time for a ship to leave every E-3 on the boat is going to want to go to college or pop out a kid, or care for his pet squirrel.

2) Telling a sailor (or Marine, airman, soldier) to only muster once a year for a drug test and a PFT is like giving a wallet with $10,000 in it to a teenage girl or a crack whore and telling her to bring it back in full a year later.

3) Some will desert. Especially the ones that had a tough life on the inside and no esprit de corps to go with it.

4) There are going to be a lot of hoops to jump through to get out on this program. So many that the people who it is meant to be for are just going to throw their hands up and say screw it.
 

phrogpilot73

Well-Known Member
It seems like someone up there is at least trying to make a valiant effort to improve QOL, but I have some issues with this one.
I don't have any heartburn with this, and I think it's a good idea. As pointed out in the article, they're trying to figure out a way to provide incentives for retention - as they've found out, money isn't everything. The Coast Guard has had a similar program for some time. It hasn't apparently impacted their mission accomplishment (Katrina), and I'm curious as to what it does for retention. My answers below are based on the assumption that the Navy's program is going to be similar to the Coast Guard one.

1) Who decides who gets to take the time off? When it comes time for a ship to leave every E-3 on the boat is going to want to go to college or pop out a kid, or care for his pet squirrel.
In order to qualify for the Coast Guard one, you have to have reached a point that you can get out. It is an unqualified resignation, with some benefits that you don't normally get when you go into the IRR. So, every E-3 on the boat isn't eligible to get out, so they wouldn't be eligible for this program. It's not like you sign up for 6 years, hit the 3 year mark and say "I want 3 years off". It's more like sign up for 6 years, hit the 6 year mark, re-enlist and say "I'll see you again in a couple of years." If anything, it's going to ensure that the depth and breadth of experience you've spent 6 years building will be back in a couple of years.

2) Telling a sailor (or Marine, airman, soldier) to only muster once a year for a drug test and a PFT is like giving a wallet with $10,000 in it to a teenage girl or a crack whore and telling her to bring it back in full a year later.
I disagree wholeheartedly with this one. Remember - it's not geared toward people who just want to get out. It's geared towards people that want to stay in, and just want a couple of years to pursue education, family, what have you. I honestly think this argument is hogwash - someone whose intent is to return at the end of 2-3 years is going to abide by it. Someone whose getting out is going to get out.

3) Some will desert. Especially the ones that had a tough life on the inside and no esprit de corps to go with it.
I doubt it. Again, it's not geared towards the bitter ones. It's geared towards those that want to stay in. The ones with a tough life will get out. Hmm, if you were a young knucklehead that had a rough life and no esprit de corps, and you can either get out at 4 years - and spend 4 years in the IRR with no requirements for drug tests/PFTs, or you can apply for 1/15th of your pay but have the drug tests & PFTs, which are you gonna choose? You're going to say "Fuck the Suck" and get out.

4) There are going to be a lot of hoops to jump through to get out on this program. So many that the people who it is meant to be for are just going to throw their hands up and say screw it.
I doubt it. If you read the Coast Guard instruction, it's an unqualified resignation. In the Marine Corps, that means a Page 11 entry. You get out with a Reserve Commission. That happens all the time in the Corps. Some people affiliate with reserve units, some don't. The only "hoop" to jump into is to submit a letter intending to return to active duty. Big deal.

Oh, and I've got a little bit of a surprise for you - this "program" merely streamlines a process that already exists in your beloved Corps. You can get out, go IRR/affiliate with a reserve unit, then request to Return to Active Duty (provided you're not a LtCol or higher). They hold quarterly boards to accomplish this. As a matter of fact, there's at least one general that did just that.
 

usmarinemike

Solidly part of the 42%.
pilot
Contributor
Good to go. Thanks for that. Actually, the answer to the first question answers the rest. Once that requirement is set down it pretty much eliminates the rest of the questions. I was just looking at the worst case scenario of having the program open to anybody who wanted to apply. Seems it passes the reasonable man test when you only make it an option for people who are beyond their first term.

The S&S article didn't even implicitly mention that point, and I'm clearly not clever enough to think it up myself as I loft my peanut gallery poop towards the stage over my morning coffee.
 

SkywardET

Contrarian
Looks like it's a way to cater to lifers. Doesn't sound like an innately bad idea at all.

If all bases are covered, it will be yet another sweet deal to look forward to. As if BAH, free PRK surgery, and STA-21 weren't sweet enough. Those are just the things which I have benefited from personally (or planning to benefit from, in the case of STA-21).
 

eddie

Working Plan B
Contributor
If you're going to capitalize Marine, please give the same respect to Sailor.

"Are you a sailor?" "Yes, I belong to XYZ yacht club."

vs.

"Are you a sailer?" "No, a sailer is a boat that moves at the leisure of the wind."

vs.

"You Sailor? Me love you long time!" "YES!"
 
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