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Drug Boat Strike
- Thread starter Griz882
- Start date
I could go down several rabbit holes ranging from the expectation from US constituents regarding the conduct of using hostile force, the foundation of human rights in western civilization, or a more technical ROE debate. BUT based off of this bullshit response here, I suspect I would get better results pissing into the wind trying to put out a fire. You failed to utilize any context and provide clarity on your statement… and if you’re stance is “well we can do this thing here, so all military strikes are legal no matter what” okay… sure but only in your hypothetical Bozo clown world in which actual service members don’t operate.
The erosion (in whatever political context or timeframe you want to use) of the LOAC in any form is a massive issue. People forget why we developed these rules and code of conduct. I suspect if the shoe was on the other foot, both sides of the American public would have much more to say about the issue. The mental gymnastics being played to justify the double tap by a few typical suspects here is incredulous.
You presume the majority would find the Pred Porn abhorrent, but I’m not so sure. Cruelty seems to be the point with the current admin, with this just being one instance. I feel like we are being conditioned.
Starting with kneecapping foreign aid that saved hundreds of thousands of lives (majority children) each year, anonymous masked agents, arresting illegal, immigrant parents dropping their kids off at school, sending them to horrific prisons in Central America, moving on to “lethality not legality” and now taking what had been a law enforcement task for decades and decades (I did a ton of drug interdiction in the late 90s) and just…killing people.
Good opinion article by Phil Klay.
The president inhabits a position of moral leadership. When the president and his officials sell their policies, they’re selling a version of what it means to be an American — what should evoke our love and our hate, our disgust and our delight. If all governments rest on opinion, as James Madison thought, then it is this moral shaping of the electorate that gives the president his freedom of action, and that we will still have to reckon with once he is gone.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
Secretary of State Marco Rubio and the President of Kenya just signed a huge foreign health aid package.
Their speech explains why they believe USAID is not the answer.
First, USAID could’ve done the exact same thing that the Department of State is doing here.
Second, Kenya's president said the money would be used to work towards the country's priorities, such as buying modern equipment for hospitals and boosting the health workforce.
"I assure you that every shilling and every dollar will be spent efficiently, effectively, and accountably," Ruto added.
LOL, sending money to an African government and expecting them to spend the money efficiently, effectively, and accountably on their population is nuts.
Third, there is absolutely zero reason to have completely cut off this critical aid for 11 months. They could’ve transitioned instead of starting from scratch.
It’s the cruelty, stupid.
Look at the sanitation of the battle for the Al-Sina prison complex and the reporting at the time… then look at this last week’s events in the same media. I can only imagine the discussion we would be having had Trump been in office on the optics of that event vs striking a drug boat. Sorry but the feigned shock and indignation by some on the intel committee is just acting, and it’s morally inconsistent if that’s the hill they’ve chosen to fight this battle over. The aversion or acceptance of combat footage though… go to cesspools of Reddit or other social media sewers at the amount of FPV kill tape being viewed. We aren’t the morally evolved species we claim to be.
The President has made open statement on the fact he intended to leverage all forms of resources to stop the flow of drugs including the use of force against designated foreign terror orgs. And it’s not like we just decided to park the coast guard and hellfire our way to victory here. We’ve got mobilized troops on the border assisting joint agency work, we’ve got assets and infrastructure investment to maintain a credible network of not just strikes but all forms of effort to stop this. And yes we have drug boats being targeted as that is the economic center of gravity for the opponent. There is a reason we are broadcasting these strikes, because to establish deterrence to an action you have to demonstrate a credible threat of the action.
Information space as a domain of warfare and all that jazz.
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Politics and comparisons with GWOT era land strikes notwithstanding, I'm having a hard time seeing how this was justified vis-à-vis the DoD law of war manual; particularly the section on non international armed conflict, which not only outlines that international armed conflict principles and policies will generally still apply, but also specifically prescribes that shipwrecked persons will be protected.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
I was responding to your accusation that the administration doesn't want to provide healthcare aid to struggling countries out of cruelty. That's patently false.
You're free to disagree with the best or most efficient means to provide that aid. That's an entirely separate argument.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
This is why we study principles and not just procedures...
The footnote in the LOAC next to the sentence regarding shipwrecked personnel points to a German U-boat attack on a hospital ship. The CO of the ship, a LT, used the "I was following orders" defense in international court and that defense was upheld on appeal. His superior officer was never tried.
Quite frankly, it's sloppy writing by the staff officers who wrote the manual.
There is a difference between when the ship is the target (conventional warfare) and the people are the target (counter-terrorism / unconventional warfare).
Commander USSOCOM spent 8 hours walking Congress through his targeting and fires process, after which every single person nodded "oh yeah, I guess that wasn't a war crime."
That's a lie.
Spekkio
He bowls overhand.
Perhaps you should write your Senators about it. I'm sure they're itching to pass a resolution to tell Trump to stop using force against TCOs.
One of my Senators happens to be the minority leader and he has no interest in putting a stop to what Trump is doing. His #1 priority is expanding ACA subsidies and he couldn't care less about the details of drug boat strikes. He also couldn't care less if military and DOD civilians get paid.
Btw, oh, look over there... SIGNAL!
Not sure what any of this has to do with the fact that you just blatantly lied to everyone on this thread about what happened in the briefing - as though you had any clue. You're a real piece of work. This is why nobody here takes you seriously.
I think you mean "hearsay", though if WaPo was able to produce heresy in their newspaper it might be a boon for their circulation numbers.
Autocorrect strikes again.
Again, they had every opportunity to transition to a different mode of interaction while maintaining care, but instead they proudly took a chainsaw to USAID and cut it all off. All of it. Gone. No warning, no time to prep.
That's the cruelty.
Now, 11 months later, they are getting around to establishing an aid program with a single African country.
Woohoo!