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Should I stay or should I go? Or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying And Love HSC.

wlawr005

wlawr005

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
red_stang65 said:
@Brett327 , not trying troll or dig at you personally.

Like I said before, the frustration with this topic is lack of knowledge/understanding/support by higher level decision makers. Unfortunately, that lack of understanding starts at the junior levels as evidenced by second tour folks & SFWTIs who go on to be COs, who go on to be senior NAE leaders. And many of those tell HSC what/how to do things without ever really knowing the basics of the community.

If you/they haven’t gotten the understanding at your level, that’s indicative of a major communication/education failure on a number of parts. For some, it’s lack of opportunity or exposure, for others it’s willful ignorance. Again, not pointing fingers at anyone.
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While we are talking about understanding the basics of other communities....it's SFTI not SFWTI.

Just saying....being mad a at Growler EWO for not understanding VBSS is kind of weird. Especially considering in all his CVN deployments he probably saw dudes fast rope out of a -60....what....maybe once. Not really a high profile mission, especially considering HSC mostly gets the opportunity to train to that at night on no fly days.

I'd say the argument is kind of a double edged sword for you as well considering the HSC CAG argument. I guarantee Brett understands the VFA/VAQ/VAW roles in the air wing at least as well as any HSC CO...most likely better. If you really wanted to point fingers at who doesn't understand what about other communities, just watch the friendly HSC bro stand Bravo Papa and figure out a simple tanker plan. It's not in their wheelhouse, so I wouldn't expect an HSC DH to understand something every, single VFA JO could speak to without batting an eye. It's different swim lanes man.
 
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red_stang65

Well-Known Member
pilot
Totally agree that it’s different swim lanes. But that watchstander or HSC CO most likely isn’t telling the VFA/VAQ squadrons their training pipeline is misaligned and that they should be happy with only flying the tanker line. After all, the Air Force got in theater and has better bombers, squadrons that focus solely on ISR, better on station time, or just “do it better.” In fact, why are the VFA/VAQ folks flying tanker lines anyway? Isn’t that what KC-135s are for?
 
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UInavy

Registered User
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
red_stang65 said:
Totally agree that it’s different swim lanes. But that watchstander or HSC CO most likely isn’t telling the VFA/VAQ squadrons their training pipeline is misaligned and that they should be happy with only flying the tanker line. After all, the Air Force got in theater and has better bombers, squadrons that focus solely on ISR, better on station time, or just “do it better.” In fact, why are the VFA/VAQ folks flying tanker lines anyway? Isn’t that what KC-135s are for?
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1.) No one “in” those communities cares about your training pipeline. Now, someone “from” those communities may be in a position to have a vested interest in your man, train, equip and therefore care.

2.) I can’t believe I’m doing this, but....- read (or skim) JP 3-32. It’s becoming increasingly clear that you don’t have a clear concept of how we fit into Joint Operations.

It’s clear that someone stepped out of their swim lane and told you what your community should be doing at some point. That doesn’t mean everyone thinks that way or that they were right. It also doesn’t mean that everyone in a different community is out to get you. Relax, read the pub and get an idea that we’re all in supporting roles of some sort.
 
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red_stang65

Well-Known Member
pilot
Ok, sarcasm filters obviously haven’t been applied. Those hypothetical comments about the roles of VAQ/VFA were from a hypothetical HSC Bravo Papa watchstander and HSC CO. Obviously there’s a lot more that each community brings to the fight than the more common lines on an air plan. My point was that most non-VFA/VAQ folks don’t try to tell the VFA/VAQ community what they should and shouldn’t do based on conscious ignorance (relax, @Brett327, not accusing you of this, because you’re honestly asking questions).

Now, take what you felt about the hypothetical statements by said-watchstander/HSC CO and imagine the daily frustrations faced by your HSC brethren when talking to NAE leadership.
 
wlawr005

wlawr005

Well-Known Member
pilot
Contributor
Hey, I feel you. I'm well familiar with the HSC plight. I was around when the HS/HC-->HSC bubbas all laughed at the Romeo. Made fun of how heavy and non-tactical it was, laughed at it's mission set. I was there when HSC started buying two piece flight suits and letting their SAR swimmers dress like team guys. Luckily I've been able to watch from the outside as HSC has been repeatedly reminded that they are not the Army and that Navy helos are for moving shit and finding submarines.

Once HSC expectations come into better alignment with reality the community will figure itself out. Ultimately, the HSC plight has been continually exacerbated by your own leadership selling you on the fact you're something that you're not. It's not the fault of any other community but your own. To be fair, the Navy could probably just as easily completely do away with HSC, plus up the Romeo squadrons with a few -S's to stand plane guard, and not even bat a fucking eye.
 
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UInavy

Registered User
pilot
Super Moderator
Contributor
red_stang65 said:
Now, take what you felt about the hypothetical statements by said-watchstander/HSC CO and imagine the daily frustrations faced by your HSC brethren when talking to NAE leadership.
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Lost me. Inter-CVW and CVW-NAE analogy doesn’t work.

“So you’re saying you’ll set my country music award on fire?”
 
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red_stang65

Well-Known Member
pilot
To the SAR issue specifically...

www.marinecorpstimes.com

Putting Marines at risk: How shocking flight medic training gaps could endanger grunts on the ground

Scarce Navy, Marine Corps flight medics are on the front lines with insufficient training.
www.marinecorpstimes.com www.marinecorpstimes.com

With smaller SAGs stationed farther apart in a Sea Control or Maritime Basing scenario, read “grunts on the ground” as “sailors at sea” away from LHDs or CVNs. Fortunately, progress is being made:


Too bad the helo community doesn’t take SAR seriously, though
 
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