I know some guys that accepted it and stayed where they were. It’s a drug deal you’d need to make in advance. One thing to consider is whether you still get promoted down the line. No more separation pay.
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Involuntary extensions
- Thread starter whitesoxnation
- Start date
Read up on title 10 us Code sections 632 and 637 for the law dictating the admin guidance for separation/continuation.
Once you 2P/ 2xFOS you seem to be entitled to separation pay under 10USC. With all of the bum gouge initially being put out by the monitors it wouldn’t surprise me if you have to fight to get it though if you accept the continuation and try to cut it short. The way the law is written you cannot be promoted on Active Duty after you’re passed over twice, even after having been continued.
What is your ultimate goal? Unless you need to get your 20 years in, if your plan is to get out anyways why on would you continue when you can get just about the same amount of flying hours wise as a reservist in a hardware unit with a fraction of the bullshit?
I get loving the job and being a member of the gun club and wanting to stay in as long as possible. I also get hating life living under the thumb of the man and wanting to get out as soon as possible. I’ve found that folks looking to accept continuation for reasons other than making it to retirement don’t always have a complete understanding of all of the options/ resources available to them and once they realize there’s an alternate way to get to their post continuation goal, outside of accepting continuation, they go for the alternate method.
I am at 101. I'm short of the magic 1,500 hours like nearly all Hornet dudes who joined the fleet in 2012 and after. I don't have a problem with leaving if required, figure I can do contract ISR for 6-12 months, bank another 1,000 hours and be highly competitive for the legacies. And yes, you have to accept/decline continuation NLT 31 Jan, at least that was the case last year.
If I can stay I should be competitive in two years and that'll give me time to find an AF Guard/Reserve squadron as well.
I shot an email to the monitor last week. I'd be interested to talk any of those dudes to find out if they incur have the option to leave at their discretion minus severance or if their new EAS is three years post accepting continuation. The only two guys I knew who took it last year went to Pensacola to fly WSOs in T-45s.
You're military. You need 750 hours with 200 cross country for a restricted ATP. For the ATP, any flight that goes more than 50 nm from the takeoff point whether it lands elsewhere or not is a cross country. So almost all your flights are cross country.
Get out and go to a regional for 1-2 years. Then
You don't need to extend or fly ISR.
Get out and go to a regional for 1-2 years. Then
You don't need to extend or fly ISR.
Regionals are scheduling their pilots around 75-85hrs a month, every month. If that’s not enough you can volunteer to fly more (with more pay) upto 100hrs a month/ 1000hrs a year. You can also stay a reservist at a hardware unit and get almost the same amount of hornet hours as you would as an AD guy with about 10% of the associated bullshit.
I would recommend declining continuation, take the seps pay, get a flying reserve job and go to a regional. It probably won’t take long.
I have an rATP with 737 Type and just over 1,000 total time, 1,250(ish) with a .3 multiplier, ASO, PMCF, IP, Division Lead, etc... It seems like ISR provides more stability with two on, two off and sounds a lot more fun than sitting reserves and/or commuting with a regional.
My current squadron is full up on reservists or I'd try to do that.
My end state would be to fly with an AF Guard or Reserve F-15/16 squadron and grab a line number somewhere. I truly just love flying fighters. Unfortunately the Marine Corps doesn't allow us to do enough of it these days at about 100-120 hours a year.
I've looked at those sections of Title 10 but couldn't find an answer as to whether I'd be able to separate prior to the end of continuation.
101 and 112 are the only squadrons I'd be interested in. Not that it's not a great deal, I'm just not interested in flying T-45s or anything else.
A catch with your plan is that typically ANG or AFR won’t take you after you fail to select twice... unless you pick up O-4 in the reserves then go over. Accepting continuation as an AD O-3 isn’t going to make you any progress in getting picked up as an O-4 in the reserves. Options seem to be either resign prior to 2P/ 2xFOS or get passed over twice and get into a reserve status ASAP to be able to promote on that side then go over as an O-4. I’d call an ANG/AFR unit to confirm what their limitations are in accepting officers who’ve failed to promote.
Why limit yourself to a single squadron flying hornets for the reserves? There’s a fair chance that you’re aquadron may not have any openings for reservist even if you take continuation there. You can associate anywhere. I’d recommend rushing ANG/AFR/USNR tacair squadrons 12 months out prior to separation to associate directly with them.
ISR isn’t a bad gig, but part 121 time would likely be better for your resume, especially when you’re able to be a part 121 Captain as soon as you hit 1000hrs SIC time @ some companies (others want 1000 121 SIC time and 2500TT) in 12-18 months. Saying your willing to commute to the reserve unit tends to be recieved better when you’re an airline pilot... most of the other pilots in the unit will be airline guys so they’ll be more likely to buy that you’ll be able to make such a commute if you’re plan is to be another airline guy.
4 year degree and 737 type rating will allegedly get you an interview with SWA once you meet all of their other minimums according to the People Department reps at the job fairs. ISR guys have had poor results at their SWA interviews the last couple of years. Part of it may have been their use of Emerald Coast Interiew Consulting for interview prep and SWAs fear they’d turn around and leave for DAL and FedEx, but I know at least one ISR who pilot go called a mercenary by a SWA pilot in their interview with things going south from there (several ISR folks had problems with this same SWA pilot) and many others who got TBNT letters after their interview.
Lots of variables to juggle for sure, but based on your stated end goal accepting continuation probably the least desireable path to get there. Being brought over as an O-3 before being passed over is the easiest for the ANG/AFR, followed by being an O-4.
Perhaps give a second thought to the T-45's. Extremely rewarding to work with a struggling SNA until they finally see the light and get their wings. Also, there is a chance you could work your way back to 101 or 112 while flying in CNATRA - but those here in the know will have a better idea of that possibility.
Also, the BS level in CNATRA seemed to be quite low compared to fleet squadrons (Alpaca farm excepted.)
I interviewed with an Eagle squadron I'm interested in but couldn't meet their availability. I informed them that I'd likely be twiced passed and the CO said, "Your first day here we'll hand you the keys to one of those Eagles and give you a blue hat with a gold oak leaf too." Of course that was after he and I crushed a bottle of blue label in their bar the night prior.
Really good info on SWA though, I hadn't heard that regarding ISR. Surprised they'd be that confrontational in an interview.
The only reason I'm considering continuation is it'll keep me fighter current for Guard/Reserves and keep chipping away at the hours with all PIC/Instructor time.
I'm not downplaying that work or the experience it can provide, I would just prefer to do tactical flying vice teaching Intermediate/Advanced.
Unless you have kept your time in a civilian log book using civilian logging conventions, be careful of assuming a .3 multiplier. Make sure the airline app ask you to apply it. Some want your straight military time.
Airlines don't give a shit about ASO, PMCF, Division Lead, etc. They care about total time and PIC time. IP time might be a tie breaker at best.
Major airlines like 121 time, not ISR time. You will get to a major a lot quicker/easier if you have 121 time than you will with ISR time. Also, King Air versus RJ? Hands down RJ wins, especially if you didn't fly multi-crew heavies. Further, seniority is everything. Getting to a major the quickest gets you the best seniority,
It's your life but I know more than a few former military that had the same plan as you. They're still flying ISR while those that went regionals are not flying at The Show. True some ISR guys get there quickly, but they are more likely to be heavy multi-engine, multi-crew rather than pointy nose pilots.
It requires a 3 star to sign a waiver if you've been passed over twice.
If Barrett was rubbing elbow with these dudes at the bar like he says he was...I’m pretty sure a couple of well written letters and recommendations along their chain of command would be pretty easy to acquire. Especially when the 2P reason was most likely because of something stupid like a picture or PME.
Most states' ANG CoS is a 2 star- they don't have enough people to rate a 3 star, and therefore don't have someone with the authority to grant the waiver. That's AF/ANG bureaucracy at it's finest.