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NEWS M9 DoD Pistol Replacement Announced (Joint Handgun winner)

Brett327

Well-Known Member
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Super Moderator
Contributor
Everyone except TACAIR? Do helos still use them? Security folks? What's the reason for having the M9 and M11? They seem functionally equivalent.
 

ChuckM

Well-Known Member
pilot
Everyone except TACAIR? Do helos still use them? Security folks? What's the reason for having the M9 and M11? They seem functionally equivalent.

Helos (and Naval Aviation as a whole) have M11s. The M9 has had reliability issues and it is bulky in comparison to the M11 with much larger grip circumference, hard for smaller handed people to shoot well. There's a reason the SEALs used the P226 for years (a full size version of the 228 or M11). It's really reliable and has close to the same magazine capacity. Next to the Glock brand, it's probably got the best reputation for going bang every time you pull the trigger. It's fairly simple to operate, in that it has no external safety. An external hammer and de-cocker probably made it desirable when they made the decision. It's also a full metal frame, so in the days of anti-polymer requirements/procurement folks it was probably a natural choice.
 

Brett327

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Super Moderator
Contributor
That's all great, but it doesn't answer my question - why did the USN acquire two very similar 9mm pistols in a relatively short timeframe? Also, exactly who is still using the M9? Helos (at least east coast LAMPS) transitioned from the .38 to the M9 in the mid 90s. When did they transition to the M11? TACAIR had the M11 by 2000.
 

Jim123

DD-214 in hand and I'm gonna party like it's 1998
pilot
Pretty sure LAMPS had the M11 by about 2000. I don't think they had the M9 for very long.

The M9 is still standard around a lot of the "rest" of the Navy. The reserve centers just got them too... hundreds of M9s that have been shot a couple times at the factory.
 

nittany03

Recovering NFO. Herder of Programmers.
pilot
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That's all great, but it doesn't answer my question - why did the USN acquire two very similar 9mm pistols in a relatively short timeframe? Also, exactly who is still using the M9? Helos (at least east coast LAMPS) transitioned from the .38 to the M9 in the mid 90s. When did they transition to the M11? TACAIR had the M11 by 2000.
I'm pretty sure the answer to "who is still using the M9" is "basically everyone in DoD outside SOCOM, besides Naval Aviation and some corner cases."
 

Flash

SEVAL/ECMO
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Super Moderator
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That's all great, but it doesn't answer my question - why did the USN acquire two very similar 9mm pistols in a relatively short timeframe? Also, exactly who is still using the M9? Helos (at least east coast LAMPS) transitioned from the .38 to the M9 in the mid 90s. When did they transition to the M11? TACAIR had the M11 by 2000.

M9's were standard DoD issue from the mid-80's on and the Navy really didn't have a choice in the matter. From what I remember the M11 was procured to make up for the shortcomings of the M9 starting in the late 90's and the Navy was able to get away with buying them for aircrew and a few others due to the relatively small numbers needed.
 

Brett327

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Brings up a good question. I wonder whether the Marines in my Airwing will abide by that policy.
 

phrogdriver

More humble than you would understand
pilot
Super Moderator
If you have to keep your pistol and your sealed ammunition separate, does it really matter what kind of pistol it is?

Wait, what? When does that apply? Training? Combat?

Maybe if you keep them both in glass boxes with little hammers next to them?

Personally never understood the M9 hate. It's like hating vanilla ice cream. It does the job. I shot the Sig and the M9 back to back once (at the 50 yard line!), and shot the M9 better -though that could be a function of being more used to it. That said, it's getting old, and we could use an update for material condition reasons, if nothing else.
 

Treetop Flyer

Well-Known Member
pilot
Wait, what? When does that apply? Training? Combat?

Maybe if you keep them both in glass boxes with little hammers next to them?

Personally never understood the M9 hate. It's like hating vanilla ice cream. It does the job. I shot the Sig and the M9 back to back once (at the 50 yard line!), and shot the M9 better -though that could be a function of being more used to it. That said, it's getting old, and we could use an update for material condition reasons, if nothing else.
Navy dudes in here have mentioned that they fly combat sorties with their ammo separate and sealed, and it's a big no-no to open it. No idea if that still goes on but I figured I'd tease them. I flew with a round chambered every single time, and I'm pretty sure I would make a point of ripping open the ammo and chambering a round if I was faced with such a policy.
 

nittany03

Recovering NFO. Herder of Programmers.
pilot
None
Super Moderator
Contributor
Wait, what? When does that apply? Training? Combat?
Combat. Had to do it every freaking time in OEF.
Navy dudes in here have mentioned that they fly combat sorties with their ammo separate and sealed, and it's a big no-no to open it. No idea if that still goes on but I figured I'd tease them. I flew with a round chambered every single time, and I'm pretty sure I would make a point of ripping open the ammo and chambering a round if I was faced with such a policy.
It's all fun and games until they send you home for doing that . . . don't know if they'd follow through on the threat, but that's what we were told at an AOM in no uncertain terms.
 
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