Officer/Enlisted Relationships

[NickHugon]

I'm in the process of applying for a commission as an Intel officer in the Navy, and I have a girlfriend of about 3.5 years now who I will eventually marry. I understand that there wouldn't be huge problems with an enlisted married couple or an officer married couple, but that an officer being married to an enlisted sailor would be complicated.

My girlfriend is also considering Intel officer (she also has a bachelor's degree) but thinks that some enlisted rates might be more in line with her interests. Does anyone in this community have any insight as to what sort of scenarios might arise from our situation assuming I were to receive a commission and my girlfriend were to enlist?

 

[wlawr005]

Meh, it happens. It happens a lot in the STA-21 program if the spouses are dual military. As long as you guys aren't at the same command, it's pretty much a non-issue.

 

[squorch2]

Ehhhh, if you're not already married by the time you commission, this could pose problems down the road...

Dating, shared living accommodations, intimate or sexual relations, commercial solicitations, private business partnerships, gambling and borrowing money between officers and enlisted members, regardless of service, are unduly familiar and are prohibited.

Probably worth talking to Legal about.

 

[IRfly]

As said above, it's probably not going to be a big issue if you're at the same command. One good thing about Intel is that there are billets for Intel folks EVERYWHERE, so it would be MORE LIKELY that you'd be able to at least live in the same area. Keep in mind, it's never a guarantee, and certainly not a promise that you'd both be home for dinner every night. But it would be more likely with intel than with many other career fields.

 

[Flash]

Meh, it happens. It happens a lot in the STA-21 program if the spouses are dual military. As long as you guys aren't at the same command, it's pretty much a non-issue.

He is talking about a pretty different scenario, one I haven't encountered yet in my time in unlike the one you describe. While maybe not prohibited by the letter of the law it could get sticky on a practical level.

 

[wlawr005]

Maybe. I've been to several commissioning ceremonies where an enlisted spouse gave the first salute. Granted, they were already married when they were both enlisted, so it is fairly different.

OP, get your commission, marry your girl. If she wants to enlist later down the road, the appropriate people will advise you of your options. There are too may 'what ifs' right now to clearly define your position.

 

[webmaster]

I would think that you would be more concerned with the difficulties and challenges that come with MIL/MIL marriages (different deployments, geo bach/not collocated, etc).

Best of luck with whatever you all decide!

 

[exNavyOffRec]

first get accepted into Intel, which NRC is currently not acceptiong applications for, then I will tell you why Officer and enlisted relationship is a bad idea.

 

[FormerRecruitingGuru]

There's an E8 at my command whoae husband is an O4. No big deal.

 

[nittany03]

As I understand it, frat regs generally are not designed to crush a pre-existing relationship. That said, your definition and the Navy's definition of that may not align, especially in a dating relationship as opposed to a marriage. Big Blue generally honors the latter and gives less than a fuck about the former. Generally, a good rule to keep in mind is that, as an unmarried officer, dating an unmarried enlisted person will be career suicide at a minimum and a criminal offense at maximum. Sure she's the one and want to avoid that? Put a ring on it before she enlists. But I'm not a lawyer and I'm a single bachelor, so my free advice is worth every penny you paid.

The Manual for Courts-Martial has specific language about what is considered unduly familiar conduct "contrary to good order and discipline," and thus frat. Legally, for two officers in a relationship, two Chiefs, or two E-6 and below, the Government must meet a higher burden of proof to prove they committed the offense of frat. Cross the boundaries of those three groups, and the relationship itself (romantic or even undue friendship) is prima facie evidence of the offense being committed. Legally, it's automatically presumed contrary to good order and discipline unless YOU or your attorney can prove otherwise.

 

[Brett327]

Let's not nuke this.

 

[exNavyOffRec]

There's an E8 at my command whoae husband is an O4. No big deal.

I have just seen issues with a new Ensign and his E-4 wife that make me cautious, seen less issues with a CPO and the LDO spouse

 

[NickHugon]

Thanks for the responses, all. The plan would be to be married prior to actually getting in, I'm aware that they don't really care about any relationship less than marriage for the purposes of being allowed to live together/work reasonably close to one another.

 

[Brett327]

The real question you should both be asking yourselves is why your future wife, who is presumably qualified to apply as an officer, is considering the enlisted route. I can't imagine many scenarios where this would make sense and I'm thinking that her decision to lean that way is based upon bad or incomplete information. Maybe she's not competitive for Intel, but that's probably not the best reason to enlist. So, in the interest of steering you both away from a potentially bad decision, what are her motives for looking at going enlisted?

 

[NickHugon]

In addition to Intel officer, she's also interested in CTI, but doesn't have one of the degrees that they want for IWO or CWE. In fact, as far as her actual interests go, the linguistics side of things are actually more appealing to her, though everyone just seems to assume that we should be shooting for commissions since we have bachelor's degrees.

At the end of the day, it's more important for us to have a shot at being together (some of the time) than nailing down a killer pay grade. Also, the most specific indication I can get from any recruiter as to the day-to-day difference (pay aside) from O and E is "officers are managers, enlisted is more hands-on." We're both right out of college and in no way opposed to joining the Navy in a more hands-on capacity, if that is indeed what the enlisted experience is more like. Does the manager/hands-on description sound like an accurate way to describe the difference between an Intel officer and an IS, for example?