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California Is Going Under

Random8145

Registered User
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/22/opinion/22mathews.html?_r=1&ref=opinion

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124260067214828295.html

As I see it, California is the prime example of what a failure the policies of the Left are (whether followed by Democrats or Republicans). Considering the policies that wrecked California (massive social spending, high taxes, heavy regulation, environmental regulations, etc...) are what Barack Obama and the Democrats ran on, everyone needs to pay very close attention to California as this administration seems hellbent on applying these same policies on the national level, and California is the world's 7th largest economy, and once the greatest state in this nation.

The taxpayers should not have to bailout California, but if California goes under, so will the nation I think. It's just too big. But the Leftist government there, and the special interests there, namely the unions, trial laywers, and environmental whackjobs, have killed the goose that lays the golden eggs.

The same thing happened to the nation's greatest city, New York City, in the 1970s. No city followed more policies of rent and price controls, high taxes, big government, a huge budget and massive spending on entitlements and social programs.

John Kenneth Galbraith once wrote an article for the Times in the 50s asserting that if only the city's budget was twice was it was at the time, all the city's problems could be fixed. Well by the '70s, the budget was more than tripled and the city was a crime and poverty-infested, bankrupted hellhole, in which the state of New York and the federal government had to literally bail it out.

NYC has a welfare state within the welfare state to this day.

Now California, the world's 7th largest economy and our greatest state, once reknowned for having the greatest infrastructure, the best schools, the best students, and the greatest economy in the nation, has been driven straight into the ground, through policies of massive entitlement spending, incredibly strong unions, insanely stringent regulations, an environment outright hostile to business and free enterprise, out-of-control speniding, and so forth.

California, New York state, New Jersey, and so forth, are also proof that raising taxes, even when it increases revenues, rarely closes the budget, because then the special interests (which grow as the government grows, because the more government tries to regulate industry, the more industry tries to regulate the government) demand more and more money and the government decides to just spend more and more.

What states have the highest taxes in the country? California, New York, New Jersey, etc...what states have the biggest budget deficits, AGAIN, California, New York, New Jersey. Here in Upstate NY where I am, they have run commercials talking about how to fix the state's budget problems as so many businesses and wealthy individuals are leaving the state.

This creates a vicious cycle, as taxes go too high, more and more businesses and people leave, resulting in taxes having to go even higher, and so on.

The great irony is this administration will have to bail out the state that has gone down the toilet while at the same time seeking to apply the same policies on the national level (they are going to have to raise taxes significantly to pay for the massive spending of universal healthcare and whatever else they create, then there's carbon cap-and-trade they will try (General Electric, which is in bed with this administration, is hell-bent on having universal healthcare and carbon caps passed), union card check, etc...).

Another example of a country headed this way is the United Kingdom under Labour party, which first drove the UK into the ground by the 1970s, then the conservatives won power, fixed things, then grew corrupted like the Republicans did, lost power, Labour made a comeback as "New Labour," and "New Labour" has since gone on to enact the same old tired policies of massive spending, thus so mis-handling the nation's finances that it will be an enormous shock if they do not lose in the next election.
 

mmx1

Woof!
pilot
Contributor
And yet California has the largest economy of all the states and has far and away been a net contributor to the Federal coffers. That it may need help in a fiscal crisis is not a sign that it is failing. If that were true, then all the states that regularly take more Federal dollars than their constituents pay must also be failures, since we're subsidizing their failure to raise money.
http://www.taxfoundation.org/press/show/22659.html


Sometimes I can't help but feel folks are cheering for California to fail.
 

Bevo16

Registered User
pilot
Sometimes I can't help but feel folks are cheering for California to fail.

It's because we are.

It's not a matter of if it is going to fail, it's when and how bad they are going to drag others down with them. All of the idiots out there were at the center of the sub-prime mess and the entire state is a sucking hole of debt.

Screw California.
 

usmcjhwk

New Member
Ok, well, how about Kansas, a very conservative state, that can't pay its state employees and forcing them to go on furlough. The state also struggled to provide state tax refunds this year.

Obviously cutting taxes kinda hurts state revenue as well.
 

exhelodrvr

Well-Known Member
pilot
We are failing. Have been for awhile. The initial post did not mention the illegal immigration factor, which has also added to our economic and criminal problems.
 

Clux4

Banned
Well, California should creates a VAT to capture all the possible revenue illegals can generate
 

Random8145

Registered User
And yet California has the largest economy of all the states and has far and away been a net contributor to the Federal coffers. That it may need help in a fiscal crisis is not a sign that it is failing. If that were true, then all the states that regularly take more Federal dollars than their constituents pay must also be failures, since we're subsidizing their failure to raise money.
http://www.taxfoundation.org/press/show/22659.html


Sometimes I can't help but feel folks are cheering for California to fail.

HECK NO, I certainly am not. But no one can deny that the state was made great through economic liberalism (and in its heydey decent social liberalism), but since then has been over-run by the hardcore Left.

I want it to return to the policies that made it great. Unions, environmentalism, etc...are fine, but the unions have a stranglehold there, and the environmental lobby is from various environmental groups who hate industry and hate the lumber industry (because we all know trees are sacred icons that cannot be cut down), etc...and with the taxes, regulations, etc...it's so hostile to free enterprise. Then all the entitlement spending, such as the most lax welfare regulations, spending on illegals, etc...it has bankrupted the state.

Los Angelos itself, a $600 billion economy, is also in trouble.

California needs to return to economic liberalism (low taxes, free-market capitalism, limited government, etc...). Remember, Ronald Reagan himself was once this state's governor.

Ok, well, how about Kansas, a very conservative state, that can't pay its state employees and forcing them to go on furlough. The state also struggled to provide state tax refunds this year.

Obviously cutting taxes kinda hurts state revenue as well.

Taxes should be kept as low as possible, and raised to increase revenues only if absolutely necessary. Otherwise, the government should seek to cut spending. Otherwise, increasing revenues only increases government spending, and so on, that's what happened with California.

Also, there's a little bit difference between a state like Kansas having problems because of the economic crises, versus a state with the largest economy in the nation and one of the largest in the world simply being run into the ground via its own policies.

If Kansas spent far too much money, well then they weren't conservative.
 

picklesuit

Dirty Hinge
pilot
Contributor
Sometimes I can't help but feel folks are cheering for California to fail.

Actually, some of us escapee's (former residents) are hoping for it to slide off into the Pacific Ocean... It would make a great barrier reef, providing adequate tsunami protection for the rest of the country (and actually being useful)
 

PerDiem

Look what I can do!!
Actually, some of us escapee's (former residents) are hoping for it to slide off into the Pacific Ocean... It would make a great barrier reef, providing adequate tsunami protection for the rest of the country (and actually being useful)

That's what I thought this thread was about when I read the title.
 

exhelodrvr

Well-Known Member
pilot
Actually, some of us escapee's (former residents) are hoping for it to slide off into the Pacific Ocean... It would make a great barrier reef, providing adequate tsunami protection for the rest of the country (and actually being useful)


If Hollywood and San Francisco slid into the ocean, it would kill all sea life for a thousand miles!
 

Picaroon

Helos
pilot
As mmx1 pointed out, Cali gives significantly more than its share to the federal government, while many other states take significantly more. Yeah, Cali is having a tough time.

A lot of that is because of the ridiculous propositions that keep getting voted on, especially a few years back. We have a representative form of government for a reason.

But California is by no means as bad in a number of areas as plenty of other states. I think you're generalizing way too much here.
 

FormerRecruitingGuru

Making Recruiting Great Again
California has been through a slew of economic problems and somehow they always seem to prevail out of it.

Until the "Golden State" splits off from the continent, i'm not worried.
 

NUFO06

Well-Known Member
None
Without California then Gangland on the history channel would pretty much suck. I Love that show.
 

swerdna

Active Member
None
Contributor
Ok, well, how about Kansas, a very conservative state, that can't pay its state employees and forcing them to go on furlough. The state also struggled to provide state tax refunds this year.

Obviously cutting taxes kinda hurts state revenue as well.

I think you might have forgotten who has been running Kansas for the last six years.
 
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